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An atheist can be radicalized, but the radicalization needs a belief or ideology upon which to base itself - say, communism or white supremacy or utilitarianism or supply-side economics, or what-not. Thus the atheism of a radical individual is as incidental to the object of their radicalism as their hair color or language or favorite Rolling Stones song.
Not really. They don't need anything but a over-the-top view of the virtues of the Atheist concept relative to Theist or other concepts. All an Atheist needs to be "radicalized" is a desire to harshly speak or act against that which they encounter that they feel contradicts Atheism.
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One cannot be a radical atheist any more than one can be an avid and passionate non-collector of stamps - the absence of a belief, like the absence of a hobby, provides nothing which can be taken to an extreme.
Absences are just that - nothing, null, void, an empty set.
This, of course, upsets those determined to draw the equivalency between religious belief and the lack thereof that simply does not exist.
I love it when you guys break out that ridiculous analogy of "Atheism is a Religion as much as Not Collecting Stamps is a Hobby"?
I posted this before to address the matter...it is applicable here now as well:
As respects "Not Collecting Stamps" being a hobby: Not necessarily...if they merely didn't collect stamps.
BUT!...if they went on stamp-collecting forums and put up thousands, upon thousands, upon thousands of posts criticizing them for being into stamps and saying things like, "You idiot! You paid how much for that?! It's just a page of perforated paper with ink on the front and dry adhesive on the back! How ignorant can you be?! Hope you get thousands of dollars of enjoyment looking at it!"(add smacking-head Smiley)...THEN you most certainly would have the hobby (could even be called the "religion") of not-collecting stamps.
Just like the "radical" Theists that take offense to those that do not embrace the same theological view that they do...when you get Atheists that proclaim religion/theology to be "The Greatest Threat To Mankind", and/or saying that they believe that parents that teach religion to their children should be arrested, prosecuted, and jailed for child abuse...you are seeing a "radical" Atheist viewpoint. And you can find both radical positions right here on this forum.
I think the problem, Vizio, is that Christianity, or any religion for that matter, is what the person who believes in it makes of it and establishes it as in their own mind. In YOUR version of Christianity, it's simply non-violent. That's fine. I'm actually happy to hear that. But, the problem with religion has been and always will be its ambiguity and extreme openness to interpretation. That means that what you think is Christianity is different from what another person thinks is Christianity or Christian-based or Christian-principled or... whatever. That's part of the reason why there are so many different sects, divisions, and branches of Christianity in today's world. If it weren't so ambiguous, there'd be a lot more consensus - and far fewer arguments in the Christianity forum.
Not just my mind. There is NO Christian teaching that makes it violent. None. There really is no ambiguity within it. Jesus himself said the greatest commandment is to love God with all your heart, soul, strength and mind, and to love your neighbor as yourself. There really is no ambiguity in that. Christianity is not about doing violence to another.
You know it would seem that 'radicalization' or being radical' implies say a movement away from the 'mean' or the 'preferred' or the 'commonly understood'. Under those circumstances there would plenty of opportunities for atheists to be radicalized say in the sense of converting to another intellectual/spiritual belief.
Under that definition some may even be so 'radical' to perhaps come around and believe in a creator. Then the question comes up on how 'radical' do they do indeed become. Would they be perhaps the new Torquemada against the secular faith?? Radicalism sure can go in many ways!
Not really. They don't need anything but a over-the-top view of the virtues of the Atheist concept relative to Theist or other concepts. All an Atheist needs to be "radicalized" is a desire to harshly speak or act against that which they encounter that they feel contradicts Atheism.
Good one mate. Redefine radical to fit what you need to pin the label onto atheists, never mind that you thereby define anyone who puts their points forcefully as a radical. You may as well claim that sheer amount of effort we put in countering the religious claims makes us a religion...
Well speak of the devil..
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I love it when you guys break out that ridiculous analogy of "Atheism is a Religion as much as Not Collecting Stamps is a Hobby"?
I posted this before to address the matter...it is applicable here now as well:
As respects "Not Collecting Stamps" being a hobby: Not necessarily...if they merely didn't collect stamps.
BUT!...if they went on stamp-collecting forums and put up thousands, upon thousands, upon thousands of posts criticizing them for being into stamps and saying things like, "You idiot! You paid how much for that?! It's just a page of perforated paper with ink on the front and dry adhesive on the back! How ignorant can you be?! Hope you get thousands of dollars of enjoyment looking at it!"(add smacking-head Smiley)...THEN you most certainly would have the hobby (could even be called the "religion") of not-collecting stamps.
Just like the "radical" Theists that take offense to those that do not embrace the same theological view that they do...when you get Atheists that proclaim religion/theology to be "The Greatest Threat To Mankind", and/or saying that they believe that parents that teach religion to their children should be arrested, prosecuted, and jailed for child abuse...you are seeing a "radical" Atheist viewpoint. And you can find both radical positions right here on this forum.
Laugh, call it 'ridiculous' and play the 'sweet reason' card, overlooking that the earth going round the sun is not the 'radical' view, it is the right one, and the reasonable tolerant view that both the earth and the sun half -revolve about each other is 'ridiculous'.
You argue brilliantly old son, and that is why, even through your argument are the veriest claptrap, I am obliged to show how full of clap they are, and risk it making me look 'radical'.
Absolutely, and it has happened before. During the French Revolution a group called "The Cult of Reason" burned down churches and killed thousands to create a "godless society."
Not to mention that prick in North Carolina who killed two innocent Muslims, or that Discover Channel shooting guy.
But I love how atheists come out and say "that wasn't real atheism!" and yet snort when a Muslim says that ISIS "isn't real Islam" or a Christian says "Focus on the Family isn't really Christian."
I love it when you guys break out that ridiculous analogy of "Atheism is a Religion as much as Not Collecting Stamps is a Hobby"?
I posted this before to address the matter...it is applicable here now as well:
As respects "Not Collecting Stamps" being a hobby: Not necessarily...if they merely didn't collect stamps.
BUT!...if they went on stamp-collecting forums and put up thousands, upon thousands, upon thousands of posts criticizing them for being into stamps and saying things like, "You idiot! You paid how much for that?! It's just a page of perforated paper with ink on the front and dry adhesive on the back! How ignorant can you be?! Hope you get thousands of dollars of enjoyment looking at it!"(add smacking-head Smiley)...THEN you most certainly would have the hobby (could even be called the "religion") of not-collecting stamps.
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That would be a very good point however, no stamp collector that I know is interested in trying to get stamp collecting meeting houses nontaxable or wanting stamp collecting taught in schools or finagling to get stamps imprinted on our coinage or given homage to before dinner gatherings, nor any laws made that effect even non-stamp collectors, etc, etc, etc.
Stamp collectors are pretty much an unnoticed group that keep to themselves except amongst other stamp collectors.
You know it would seem that 'radicalization' or being radical' implies say a movement away from the 'mean' or the 'preferred' or the 'commonly understood'. Under those circumstances there would plenty of opportunities for atheists to be radicalized say in the sense of converting to another intellectual/spiritual belief.
Under that definition some may even be so 'radical' to perhaps come around and believe in a creator. Then the question comes up on how 'radical' do they do indeed become. Would they be perhaps the new Torquemada against the secular faith?? Radicalism sure can go in many ways!
Yes indeed, which is why I don't dismiss the warnings from Stalin and Pol Pot (nor VP's post above on the French Revolution cobbled together with the recent shooting) as mere smearing. That are salutary warnings about what could happen if atheism just focusses on getting its numbers up and forgets about the education, logic and understanding of the human preferences like reciprocity that are needed for a fair and just society. Radicalization, I sometimes think, is what happens when a reasonable organization gets a group within it preaching about 'This lot is too wishy -washy. We need someone with the courage of their convictions. We need someone with the guts to sock it to the opposition, and never mind how you do it!" Yes, radicalization can happen anywhere, and in atheism too, if it ever gets the clout for demagogues to try to use it for their own nasty ends.
Atheism doesn't have a list of dogmas and tenets, but it may need them. Perhaps as a non -battle cry we could have Charlie Brown's clarion call: "Stand up for your right to be wishy -washy!"
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