All Aboard Florida Question (Miami, Orlando: 2014, to rent, mover)

[manny118]

From what I've read there isn't much the State can do to stop All Aboard Florida due to this being a private project on private land.

However, could the State enact new laws that would limit the number of trains they can run if the trains causes serious traffic issues around South Florida's dense population centers like Fort Lauderdale, Boca, Delray, West Palm, etc? The train also runs close to Miami's new high end retail center in the Design District. If the this train causes enough gridlock to upset enough people in Dade, Broward, and Palm Beach County will that be enough to get the politicians to pass laws impacting the train's operations.

The traffic is already bad and getting worse in Miami and Fort Lauderdale and this train will be holding up the east west flow of traffic 32 times a day all during daylight hours. This train seems like its convenient for quick weekend trips to Orlando, but it doesn't address the need of people commuting to work. It's not like someone living in Palm Beach can suddenly start commuting into Brickell since this train only goes to downtown Miami. Once in downtown Miami the transportation options stink, like the slow moving people mover which takes forever to get to Brickell from downtown.

Also if this passenger train fails and the rail road company starts trying to run more freight trains will the State be able to pass laws to limit the impact these trains may have on the community if enough people complain in the high population areas where politicians need to be concerned with votes.

[runswithscissors]

I don't know but there's a lot of dirty tricks going on. There's no doubt in my mind that if every politician stood against it - the public would too.

Even in Brevard some idiot politicians and business owners are in favor of it. Like the Ron Jons guy. Now why is that??? For one thing, his store is not affected because it won't be demolished by eminent domain like the people along the tracks. It seems they're pretending to believe they'll eventually get a train with a train station stop on the route.

Then again, Brevard even voted for a TAX INCREASE this week.

Brevard leaders support All Aboard Florida train plan

[Rabflmom]

Originally Posted by runswithscissors

I don't know but there's a lot of dirty tricks going on. There's no doubt in my mind that if every politician stood against it - the public would too.

Even in Brevard some idiot politicians and business owners are in favor of it. Like the Ron Jons guy. Now why is that??? For one thing, his store is not affected because it won't be demolished by eminent domain like the people along the tracks. It seems they're pretending to believe they'll eventually get a train with a train station stop on the route.

Then again, Brevard even voted for a TAX INCREASE this week.

Brevard leaders support All Aboard Florida train plan

They are using existing track for this aren't they? What will be torn down? The thing I don't understand it is coming through the coastal counties but will not stop so they ared losing a whole market of people on the coast who would take a train to Miami but would never think of driving there.

The tracks are already there.
Freight already uses the tracks. It only impacts the immediate areas with the noise and you do get used to it. Lived up North where we had intersecting tracks in my hometown and you didn't even know they were there unless they stopped on the main roads. Basically, need to build some overpasses over the tracks so emergency vehicles have a way to get to the other side and not wait for trains.

I guess I am one of the stupid ones that thinks Florida needs to get some public transportation going and get away from only cars before traffic gets worse. Or we need to stop selling land and building towns and new subdivisions before we become one big traffic jam.

[TriMT7]

So much drama over absolutely nothing. It's amazing the opposition to this project. Like a cause celebre founded on fear mongering.

I know a little something about living with trains. I live smack in-between TWO train tracks: The CSX and the FEC.

CSX currently runs tri-rail at a much more frequent pace than anything planned by AAF, and that train cuts right through far more densely populated areas than anything on the Treasure Coast. Tri-Rail is a mild inconvenience at one of the busiest intersections in Palm Beach County: Okeechobee Blvd. and Parker. Life goes on, and downtown is growing rapidly. Emergency services get where they need to go, and while accidents do happen with trains, they pale in comparison to the loss of limb and life on our highways and roads.


I understand boaters are upset about the bridges. That's at least somewhat legitimate of a complaint, but I believe that bridge improvements and a more regular schedule is likely to be the end result of this project. I don't really feel too badly, however, as the BIGGEST inconvenience to traffic in downtown WPB is - bar none - drawbridges that back up traffic horrendously for up to 10 minutes (not 90 seconds, like an AAF train).



The biggest quality of life issue with living next to the trains are whistles. But because this project is coming, quiet zones are now a priority (IF you happen to live somewhere that isn't short-sighted). Also, safety improvements on the rail will come that WILL NOT BE THERE if passenger service does not run on the rails. FEC will merely increase the freight traffic with NO corresponding quiet zones, etc. and THAT affects quality of life.

[manny118]

Originally Posted by Rabflmom

They are using existing track for this aren't they? What will be torn down? The thing I don't understand it is coming through the coastal counties but will not stop so they ared losing a whole market of people on the coast who would take a train to Miami but would never think of driving there.

The tracks are already there.
Freight already uses the tracks. It only impacts the immediate areas with the noise and you do get used to it. Lived up North where we had intersecting tracks in my hometown and you didn't even know they were there unless they stopped on the main roads. Basically, need to build some overpasses over the tracks so emergency vehicles have a way to get to the other side and not wait for trains.

I guess I am one of the stupid ones that thinks Florida needs to get some public transportation going and get away from only cars before traffic gets worse. Or we need to stop selling land and building towns and new subdivisions before we become one big traffic jam.

I think a lot of people worry this is just a bait and switch to get the rails upgraded to handle increased freight. There are only four stops and it does address the needs of commuters, for that we would need a more comprehensive light rail systems throughout Dade, Broward, and Palm Beach counties.

All Aboard Florida will impact more than just the immediate area if it causes major traffic issues. People from all over the region will be dealing with this mess. Who is going to build the overpasses you suggest?

[TriMT7]

Originally Posted by manny118

I think a lot of people worry this is just a bait and switch to get the rails upgraded to handle increased freight. There are only four stops and it does address the needs of commuters, for that we would need a more comprehensive light rail systems throughout Dade, Broward, and Palm Beach counties.

The goal is to eventually integrate tri-rail on the EASTERN tracks, so that much like in Europe you have Express trains (AAF) and local trains (tri-rail on the FEC).

One foot in front of the other.


And by the way, there is ZERO reason for FEC to even suggest passenger service as a "bait and switch" for anything to do with freight.

They can run more freight tomorrow if they wanted, and nobody has any say. They could also apply for a railroad improvement line SOLELY FOR FREIGHT if they wanted to... most of those loans actually do go for rail improvements to run freight.

Originally Posted by manny188

All Aboard Florida will impact more than just the immediate area if it causes major traffic issues. People from all over the region will be dealing with this mess. Who is going to build the overpasses you suggest?

There are no overpasses necessary. There will be no "major traffic issues" when you're talking about closing an intersection for 90 seconds - the length of a traffic signal.

[SeaLark7]

I don't understand why there's a need for 16 trains each way per day. Really, how many people are going to use this service? When you get to Orlando (or Miami) by train, you still need a means of transport to get to your destination. It's not like the old days when a train arrived in a city and you could just walk to where you wanted to go, or take a short cab ride. Most people will have to rent a car once they get off the train. How much time and money are saved ? Are hundreds of people anxiously waiting for this train service ? I seriously doubt it. I could see maybe 4 trains a day each way, but 16 is ridiculous.

[DanielAvery]

Are hundreds of people anxiously waiting for this train service ? I seriously
doubt it. I could see maybe 4 trains a day each way, but 16 is ridiculous.

That is part of my skepticism, as well. AMTRAK gives the Post Office a run for the money in quarterly losses, and yet AAF acts as if this passenger rail service is in such demand? They want permission to run that many trains, but when there is a demonstrated lack of interest for passenger service, they will either cut back the number of trips, or find something else (freight) to make that number of trips worthwhile. I think they've already made that leap, of course.

Several notices have quietly gone out to small towns along the path that current traffic will have to be re-routed due to the trains. In my local case, a left-turn lane that allows traffic to curve away from the tracks and travel on without stopping while a train goes by will be torn out if AAF goes through--surveyors gave no explanation. Taking out that left turn will cause twice as much traffic to back up, since that left turn funnels traffic onto Dixie Highway. So the tracks might already exist, but there will be changes made to the surrounding areas that will cause havoc.

[PDF]

Originally Posted by SeaLark7

I don't understand why there's a need for 16 trains each way per day. Really, how many people are going to use this service? When you get to Orlando (or Miami) by train, you still need a means of transport to get to your destination. It's not like the old days when a train arrived in a city and you could just walk to where you wanted to go, or take a short cab ride. Most people will have to rent a car once they get off the train. How much time and money are saved ? Are hundreds of people anxiously waiting for this train service ? I seriously doubt it. I could see maybe 4 trains a day each way, but 16 is ridiculous.

Well I completely disagree with that. That's part of the appeal to AAF. Amtrak only runs like once a day along this route. In order for this to be a viable option for many people, you're going to need that frequent service. Sometimes I have wanted to take Amtrak between some Florida cities, but the time it runs at was just never convenient. 4 a day each way could have worked too, but I'm glad they are going all in.

Looking at the locations of the train stations, it's not like most people are going to have to go very far to get where they ultimately want to go.

[dendrobium]

Seriously why would I be in favor of trains coming through here 32 times per day THAT I CAN'T EVEN USE?!! If it stopped here it would be one thing. That is the rudest thing ever to us who live on this route. WHY would any of us want it?
Even those who could use it won't want to because like the other poster said, once you get to the destination you still need transportation. Sounds like a whole lot of inconvenience. I bet everyone will keep on riding down in cars while these empty trains race back and forth disturbing our towns.