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Because you seem to be diving pretty deep into the minutia of standardized test scores, you may want to consider that the Opt-Out movement (https://www.fairtest.org/get-involved/opting-out) has had significant growth in recent years and could be influencing the fluctuations you are seeing. I'm not sure if it's as much of a thing in wealthy suburban districts where parents clearly prioritize test score results, but here in the city we've had multiple communications/instructions/tools sent home to parents to inform their decision on whether to opt in or out. I have some cognitive dissonance about this issue- historically these same test results have shown that middle-/upper-income students in MPS district do as well or better than their socioeconomically-matched counterparts in every other district in the state, which I think helps to promote racially/socioeconomically integrated schools-- but ultimately we will be opting out of standardized tests for our child this year.
While I know that standardized tests have their pitfalls, I do think they have a purpose. I would reduce them to a single 2-hour test each year (40 mins each for Math, English, and Science), and use it mostly to identify schools that are in critical shape (e.g. a high % of 7th graders can't add 1/4 + 1/4, or are reading at the 3rd grade level).
Having said that, I'm really disappointed that schools are going to burn a large chunk of remaining in-person time with standardized testing to confirm what pretty much everyone knows - students fell behind. Schools should be using this time to salvage whatever is left of the year.
Also - since the tests must be taken in person, that means probably 20-30% will opt out for COVID reasons. In my experience in our suburban district, a lot of the distance learning students were the top students - their parents are supplementing at home with private tutors, Kahn Academy, etc.
We're definitely opting out and taking the kids to a museum or doing math problems at home on those days.
Just an update to this- after a lot of research we’ve decided to move to Eagan or Apple Valley. I was deciding between district 196 vs Minnetonka vs Wayzata but the latter two seem to have way to much competition in terms of resources and sports and I don’t want my kids to feel left out. We are now looking for affordable homes but the market is ruthless here
Just an update to this- after a lot of research we’ve decided to move to Eagan or Apple Valley. I was deciding between district 196 vs Minnetonka vs Wayzata but the latter two seem to have way to much competition in terms of resources and sports and I don’t want my kids to feel left out. We are now looking for affordable homes but the market is ruthless here
Just an update to this- after a lot of research we’ve decided to move to Eagan or Apple Valley. I was deciding between district 196 vs Minnetonka vs Wayzata but the latter two seem to have way to much competition in terms of resources and sports and I don’t want my kids to feel left out. We are now looking for affordable homes but the market is ruthless here
I would argue that school district is important, but after a certain point, it's not the schools themselves that are producing amazing students, or the fact that class sizes are only 24 instead of 27, or whatever. It's that the kids are motivated and pushed by their very-involved parents. They would be successful at just about any decent district in the state.
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Yep ^^!(and a few more!!! ) So much so that we never paid attention to "average" test scores. Rather, we would have moved if there wasn't a cluster of talented/motivated families inside of the district/school. And a key parameter is to make sure the district well funded.
We lived in Andover but the boundaries were in Anoka. 20%++ percent of the kids were struggling to meet the most basic skills. Why? Look at the parents and follow the money. Yet another large group came from motivated and educated families. As in, there was a bimodal distribution of kids. Our kids mostly tested in the top percentiles with a couple of small bumps along the way. Fast forward. DD is a dentist. DS is a doc (went to Harvard medical school). But we were passionate in the parenting department.
Quote:
Originally Posted by UMN2BE
Be advised that at certain districts (like Wayzata and MV) there's a lot of competition and fill with kids (mostly of Asian immigrants) who have been studying 24/7/365 since kindergarten. I went to a so-so district and got a STEM PhD at a top-5 program. My best friend at the same school went to a top-10 medical school. I flourished in a less-cutthroat environment, but probably would've buckled had I been sent to a "top tier" high school.
Anyways, best of luck to you.
Boy, do you get it ^^! To illustrate just two examples (there are a 100), our son was the captain of the cross country team, a captain in Track, played varsity hockey, etc. Mind you, he graduated with 600+ kids. Even the ultra-competitive Wayzata district cross country team had JV runners faster than the middle of the pack Anoka varsity team. In hockey, Anoka had about 50 Pee Wees trying out. In Wayzata, there were 250 and they were already sorted out (many players already have dropped out). While we went to hockey camps, the programs were littered with kids from Wayzata.
I predict our son would not have been on any varsity team let alone a captain of two. And that would impact confidence which interacts with motivation. Eventually, all the boxes were checked for a college application "2x captain, 3 sport varsity letterer, Boys State, advanced classes, 1st in his class, took the most advanced classes possible etc" and that opened all kinds of doors to his top-tier UG degree. In summary, his opportunities allowed a better college resume, more leadership roles, and more accolades. But much more important than those titles was the massive confidence boost you get and the leadership experience and sucess. And in the end, that course in life allowed him to develop to his full potential. As you mentioned, I'm convinced the end game would have been a lot different if he moved to Plymouth (I was close to buying a lot versus Andover). It might not have ended as well. Our DS attended HMS (Harvard Medical School). He isn't "smarter", rather he is smart and has a ton of motivation to do his very best. He is competitive as can be and having the ability to play varsity sports shaped him.
In our DD example the benefits of not picking an ultra competitive connected district, she had a less-than-ideal standardized math test score back in around 3rd grade. So she placed down a level the following year. I called the teacher and the school. Because we were involved, they knew who we were. I explained that I wanted her to be in the top math class and that I personally guaranteed she would rise to the occasion. I politely explained I would work with her every night until she mastered the material. They agreed. As an import, she was friends with the more motivated kids. Working hard and seeing the results builds confidences and self esteem. Hanging with the right crowd keeps them out of trouble too.
Like our son, she played varsity LaCrosse, Hockey, and softball (all brutally competitive inside of Wayzata). Like our son, she did full-time PSEO in 11th and 12th grade. So I'd argue that there is no better caliber school for 11th and 12th grade than going to a university and testing the waters IF they are up for the challenge. They still were in HS sports and connected with their classmates. But if you want to prove to a college that they can handle advanced material, maybe send them to college versus AP ______.
In the end, no one is going to convince me that they teach math or reading or science better at Wayzata than a below average standardized testing school HS like Anoka. DS was a Rhodes finalist (not a winner). We have pictures of him shaking the Presidents hand with college academic awards. Yet parents are so focused on average MN test scores? Too many have a simplistic POV on this K-12. They hone in on standardized test scores. How about learning how to interact with all kinds of people from more diverse backgrounds. Or seeing up close and personal what happens when other parents don't care as much? Anyways, I'm glad the OP figured it out. Best of luck to her.
Yep ^^!(and a few more!!! ) So much so that we never paid attention to "average" test scores. Rather, we would have moved if there wasn't a cluster of talented/motivated families inside of the district/school. And a key parameter is to make sure the district well funded.
We lived in Andover but the boundaries were in Anoka. 20%++ percent of the kids were struggling to meet the most basic skills. Why? Look at the parents and follow the money. Yet another large group came from motivated and educated families. As in, there was a bimodal distribution of kids. Our kids mostly tested in the top percentiles with a couple of small bumps along the way. Fast forward. DD is a dentist. DS is a doc (went to Harvard medical school). But we were passionate in the parenting department.
Boy, do you get it ^^! To illustrate just two examples (there are a 100), our son was the captain of the cross country team, a captain in Track, played varsity hockey, etc. Mind you, he graduated with 600+ kids. Even the ultra-competitive Wayzata district cross country team had JV runners faster than the middle of the pack Anoka varsity team. In hockey, Anoka had about 50 Pee Wees trying out. In Wayzata, there were 250 and they were already sorted out (many players already have dropped out). While we went to hockey camps, the programs were littered with kids from Wayzata.
I predict our son would not have been on any varsity team let alone a captain of two. And that would impact confidence which interacts with motivation. Eventually, all the boxes were checked for a college application "2x captain, 3 sport varsity letterer, Boys State, advanced classes, 1st in his class, took the most advanced classes possible etc" and that opened all kinds of doors to his top-tier UG degree. In summary, his opportunities allowed a better college resume, more leadership roles, and more accolades. But much more important than those titles was the massive confidence boost you get and the leadership experience and sucess. And in the end, that course in life allowed him to develop to his full potential. As you mentioned, I'm convinced the end game would have been a lot different if he moved to Plymouth (I was close to buying a lot versus Andover). It might not have ended as well. Our DS attended HMS (Harvard Medical School). He isn't "smarter", rather he is smart and has a ton of motivation to do his very best. He is competitive as can be and having the ability to play varsity sports shaped him.
In our DD example the benefits of not picking an ultra competitive connected district, she had a less-than-ideal standardized math test score back in around 3rd grade. So she placed down a level the following year. I called the teacher and the school. Because we were involved, they knew who we were. I explained that I wanted her to be in the top math class and that I personally guaranteed she would rise to the occasion. I politely explained I would work with her every night until she mastered the material. They agreed. As an import, she was friends with the more motivated kids. Working hard and seeing the results builds confidences and self esteem. Hanging with the right crowd keeps them out of trouble too.
Like our son, she played varsity LaCrosse, Hockey, and softball (all brutally competitive inside of Wayzata). Like our son, she did full-time PSEO in 11th and 12th grade. So I'd argue that there is no better caliber school for 11th and 12th grade than going to a university and testing the waters IF they are up for the challenge. They still were in HS sports and connected with their classmates. But if you want to prove to a college that they can handle advanced material, maybe send them to college versus AP ______.
In the end, no one is going to convince me that they teach math or reading or science better at Wayzata than a below average standardized testing school HS like Anoka. DS was a Rhodes finalist (not a winner). We have pictures of him shaking the Presidents hand with college academic awards. Yet parents are so focused on average MN test scores? Too many have a simplistic POV on this K-12. They hone in on standardized test scores. How about learning how to interact with all kinds of people from more diverse backgrounds. Or seeing up close and personal what happens when other parents don't care as much? Anyways, I'm glad the OP figured it out. Best of luck to her.
Extremely well put and obviously your children benefitted from having a wonderful parent such as yourself!!
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Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Too many have a simplistic POV on this K-12. They hone in on standardized test scores. How about learning how to interact with all kinds of people from more diverse backgrounds. Or seeing up close and personal what happens when other parents don't care as much? Anyways, I'm glad the OP figured it out. Best of luck to her. 
