[SoCal Midwest Noobie]

So the Senate has voted to make DST permanent. The bill now moves to the House where it has bipartisan support. Dont get me wrong, I love the late summer nights. And I would love the extra hour of daylight in winter, but this would push sunrise past 9 am in winter in most of the state. 8 am is bad enough! DST does not give us "extra" daylight. Most of Michigan is barely in actual Eastern Time Zone as it is. I believe only the Port Huron area barely fits in actual ET. This just annoys me to no end.

[mjlo]

The eastern seaboard is deceiving most people don't realize how far west it actually tapers. Detroit is actually further east than Atlanta. Atlanta itself is only about 10 miles east of Lansing(Okemos is pretty much due north of Atlanta). Cleveland OH is virtually due north of Jacksonville FL, while Grand Rapids is about 10 miles west of Chattanooga, and 10 miles east of Louisville.

The biggest logical problem with time zones is that they are based on political boundaries and not geographical when they were set. New York(city) is actually due north of the island of Hispaniola which is split by the Eastern/Atlantic time zone. One could make the case that New England and parts of the mid Atlantic should actually be in the Atlantic time zone.

Michigan's central position on the map means you're going to have to pick your poison when it comes to daylight. No matter how you slice, it's either on the far western edge of EST, or the far eastern edge of CST. Do you want it to get light out at almost 9am for three months? Or do you want the sun to go down before 5pm for three months?

For me personally I'll take the sunset, and a daylight drive home from the office lol.

[Cloudy Dayz]

Originally Posted by SoCal Midwest Noobie

So the Senate has voted to make DST permanent. The bill now moves to the House where it has bipartisan support. Dont get me wrong, I love the late summer nights. And I would love the extra hour of daylight in winter, but this would push sunrise past 9 am in winter in most of the state. 8 am is bad enough! DST does not give us "extra" daylight. Most of Michigan is barely in actual Eastern Time Zone as it is. I believe only the Port Huron area barely fits in actual ET. This just annoys me to no end.

8AM or 9AM, what's the difference? Most people are probably already at work or in school by 8AM anyway, or at least they have left home by that time. It's should do a good job of reducing traffic collisions due to drivers not being blinded by the rising sun, and people will be able to get home before the sun sets.

There is only a certain amount of daylight hours, and no legislation can change that. Either you go to work in the dark, or you go home in the dark. You can't have it both ways.

[Coldjensens]

Originally Posted by Cloudy Dayz

8AM or 9AM, what's the difference? Most people are probably already at work or in school by 8AM anyway, or at least they have left home by that time. It's should do a good job of reducing traffic collisions due to drivers not being blinded by the rising sun, and people will be able to get home before the sun sets.

There is only a certain amount of daylight hours, and no legislation can change that. Either you go to work in the dark, or you go home in the dark. You can't have it both ways.

This is a good point. I was kind of ambivalent, but now I am all for not driving into blinding sunlight in the morning. On weekends I usually sleep in anyway, especially in the winter. I guess I am all for permanent DST.

[DenverBrian]

I'm thinking that if this goes through, the UP especially will have a decision to make regarding whether to move to Central time.

[DTWflyer]

I think the legislation to make daylight saving permenant doesn't make sense, especially for us here in Michigan.

In Nov, Dec, Jan, Feb, we only have 8-9 hours of usable daylight.
In the winter months if we don't go back to standard time, we won't have meaningful daylight until 9-9:30am in the depth of winter. Parts of the UP it will be closer to 10am.

This has implications for a lot of things including schools, anyone who works outdoors, transportation schedules, etc.

Maybe in southern states where they have more daylight and might tend to utilize the additional hour of daylight outdoors in the winter months, but it doesn't make sense for us here in Michigan.

If thats the case, I'd rather be on Central time in the winter, and stay on Eastern time in the summer.

[DenverBrian]

Originally Posted by DTWflyer

I think the legislation to make daylight saving permenant doesn't make sense, especially for us here in Michigan.

In Nov, Dec, Jan, Feb, we only have 8-9 hours of usable daylight.
In the winter months if we don't go back to standard time, we won't have meaningful daylight until 9-9:30am in the depth of winter. Parts of the UP it will be closer to 10am.

This has implications for a lot of things including schools, anyone who works outdoors, transportation schedules, etc.

Maybe in southern states where they have more daylight and might tend to utilize the additional hour of daylight outdoors in the winter months, but it doesn't make sense for us here in Michigan.

If thats the case, I'd rather be on Central time in the winter, and stay on Eastern time in the summer.

That's just changing the clocks twice a year like we do now. You choices under the new bill are to pick one time zone and stay in it. I'd say there's an excellent chance the UP would want to move to Central (Daylight) time, and a good chance all of MI would want to.

[SoCal Midwest Noobie]

Originally Posted by DTWflyer

I think the legislation to make daylight saving permenant doesn't make sense, especially for us here in Michigan.

In Nov, Dec, Jan, Feb, we only have 8-9 hours of usable daylight.
In the winter months if we don't go back to standard time, we won't have meaningful daylight until 9-9:30am in the depth of winter. Parts of the UP it will be closer to 10am.

This has implications for a lot of things including schools, anyone who works outdoors, transportation schedules, etc.

Maybe in southern states where they have more daylight and might tend to utilize the additional hour of daylight outdoors in the winter months, but it doesn't make sense for us here in Michigan.

If thats the case, I'd rather be on Central time in the winter, and stay on Eastern time in the summer.

This. I completely agree. 8 am sunrises depress me to no end. 9 am is ridiculous. I wont lie, I'm enjoying the later sunsets. I would enjoy them in winter, but overly dark mornings I hate. It's crazy that by local sun time, we should set clocks 30 ahead of MDT right now lol. Ideally we should be a half hour deviation between Chicago and New York. I understand hating the early sunsets. Growing up in California, in winter, even though near the Mexican border, it would get dark toward 4 pm or so because it's at the eastern end of the Pacific Time Zone. I get the reasoning to align clocks to East Coast time for business. But permanent DST when we are already on a local "DST" just no.

[jbgusa]

Originally Posted by mjlo

Michigan's central position on the map means you're going to have to pick your poison when it comes to daylight. No matter how you slice, it's either on the far western edge of EST, or the far eastern edge of CST. Do you want it to get light out at almost 9am for three months? Or do you want the sun to go down before 5pm for three months?

For me personally I'll take the sunset, and a daylight drive home from the office lol.

Time zones' placement is always somewhat arbitrary. I suppose I'd pick coming home from work during the day rather than pitch black. I do like walking or jogging in the morning in some light but, clearly, you can't always get what you want.

[Sparrow_temp]

For all those that have a normal job, you should be celebrating a permanent DST change. I really don't see a downside to it. You get some daylight time after your work hours to do things outside. It's totally depressing to get home after dark in the winter.