Cincinnati-Indianapolis-Chicago high speed rail (Green, Plymouth: subdivision, prices, expense)

[rrtechno]

An option that allows people to take their car with them when they travel by train is available in many places in Europe as well as parts of the US. No one has mentioned this option here, at least not recently. I suppose though it would not fall under the category of HSR, but would certainly deserve consideration.

Guide to Motorail trains in Europe | Taking your car by train

[kjbrill]

MY Problem lies with this plain and simple. After you include all these HSR startup costs, just show me plain and simple why those living on the rails will be better off than those not living on the rails. Not too hard to extrapolate. Yes it is because they cannot guarantee 5 cents of any of that money ever being collected.

[WILWRadio]

Originally Posted by kjbrill

MY Problem lies with this plain and simple. After you include all these HSR startup costs, just show me plain and simple why those living on the rails will be better off than those not living on the rails. Not too hard to extrapolate. Yes it is because they cannot guarantee 5 cents of any of that money ever being collected.

Living on the rails will certainly lead to getting run over by a train or two. You can only dodge a train so many times before it will catch up with you.

Until the budget deficits are addressed (and the other reasons I mentioned) and paid down a lot HSR will never happen at least in the Chicago to Cincy corridor.

[Yac]

21 deleted posts later, I'm not going to close this thread, not yet anyway.
Let me make something absolutely clear: it doesn't matter where you're from, you can post here. It doesn't matter what your background, education etc is - you can post here. It doesn't really matter if your opinion is informed or ignorant - you can post here. Because after all is said and done, it is still your opinion and you know what they say about opinions.
What you cannot do here is jump on each other for having different views on the topic, whatever the topic is. You cannot mock or attack others for not thinking the way you do. You cannot hijack threads to be about specific posters you don't like. Because if you do - you will have your posts deleted and you'll have to talk to me, possibly enjoy a short (or long if it's a habit) vacation from the forum. And no one wants that - you want to post, I don't want to deal with bs issues I have to deal with.
So there. I don't know if I can make it any clearer. All I have left to add is that I wish some of you would actually learn from your past mistakes instead of making them over and over again.
Yac.

[ColdAilment]

Originally Posted by Yac

21 deleted posts later, I'm not going to close this thread, not yet anyway.
Let me make something absolutely clear: it doesn't matter where you're from, you can post here. It doesn't matter what your background, education etc is - you can post here. It doesn't really matter if your opinion is informed or ignorant - you can post here. Because after all is said and done, it is still your opinion and you know what they say about opinions.
What you cannot do here is jump on each other for having different views on the topic, whatever the topic is. You cannot mock or attack others for not thinking the way you do. You cannot hijack threads to be about specific posters you don't like. Because if you do - you will have your posts deleted and you'll have to talk to me, possibly enjoy a short (or long if it's a habit) vacation from the forum. And no one wants that - you want to post, I don't want to deal with bs issues I have to deal with.
So there. I don't know if I can make it any clearer. All I have left to add is that I wish some of you would actually learn from your past mistakes instead of making them over and over again.
Yac.

Bravo! Love it when the mods sweep in and clean up these threads that go awry.

Perhaps now we can get back to the topic at hand. I for one think the midwest could stand to gain a lot from connecting its hub cities, so long as it's a cost effective implementation of such a massive piece of infrastructure.

[goofy328]

Originally Posted by ColdAilment

Bravo! Love it when the mods sweep in and clean up these threads that go awry.

Perhaps now we can get back to the topic at hand. I for one think the midwest could stand to gain a lot from connecting its hub cities, so long as it's a cost effective implementation of such a massive piece of infrastructure.

It would really help people to discover all that it has to offer. Can't tell you how many times I just wanted a simple train from Dayton to Columbus or Cincinnati.

[WILWRadio]

Originally Posted by goofy328

It would really help people to discover all that it has to offer. Can't tell you how many times I just wanted a simple train from Dayton to Columbus or Cincinnati.

Well at some point that might work. Since the areas in between Cincy and Dayton are growing, it might be somewhat cost effective to develop a passenger rail line between the two cities in a decade or two.

Seems to me the most cost effective way to implement more rail for passenger service is to share existing rail lines with the freight companies. Freight should get the right of way but passenger trains could run when they won't impact freight trains.

[WILWRadio]

Originally Posted by jbcmh81

I'll ask again what my location has to do with the validity of what I've been saying. If you can't answer this, stop repeating it.

No, you completely don't get my view. Nowhere have I advocated that anyone should be forced to stop driving their cars. I don't think that's necessary, and I do think that cars/roads have their place and usefulness. I am simply advocating for expanding options for people who:

1. Don't like driving or value life that's not dependent on a car. Yes, these people exist, probably in larger numbers than you believe.
2. Can't physically drive due to age or physical ailments.
3. Can't afford to drive.
4. View roads as wasteful/environmentally harmful/financially destructive and would prefer using something different.

I think roads are outrageously expensive. Even if you get your way and no other forms of transit are ever invested in, the associated costs of building/maintaining roads should be passed onto drivers in full, whether that be through tolling or large increases in gas taxes- or both. Otherwise, demanding rail pay for itself is just 100% cognitive dissonance.

Please explain how rail is not a form of infrastructure first and I'll explain where they money might come from.

Yes, you are totally anti-rail. It's painfully obvious because you treat it completely differently than any other form of transit, especially your beloved road system.

How can someone that does not even live in this country, let alone the very states that are the topic of discussion have a real grasp of what will or will not work there? This is analogous to someone in Libya telling the city of Buffalo that it needs to find better ways to remove snow in the winter.

Yes, you may have a right to an opinion about this but that does not mean you are informed with the facts to comment accurately. And to claim I am anti rail is bordering on delusional. Did you read my post where I mentioned I have use trains in several different countries?

If we did not have serious fiscal problems in this country and could find the money to build the project and fund it for a while then I would be in favor of it. But it ain't gonna happen. The cost to build this line would easily exceed the entire state budget for the State of Indiana in a single year. 15 billion is the annual budget here. And since something like 90 percent of that line would run though Indiana I suspect they would be left to foot the bill for maintenance and repairs. The Feds don't have the money and neither do the states.

Again, why don't you comprehend this fact that the MONEY IS NOT THERE for this project?

[restorationconsultant]

This thread is "hypothetical" at best, especially NOW:

"The financially troubled and passenger-starved Amtrak Hoosier State line is being shut down.
The Indiana Department of Transportation said it failed to reach an agreement with Amtrak and Iowa Pacific Holdings that would keep the train running. The last day for the Hoosier State line will be April 1.
INDOT blamed the Federal Railroad Administration for burdensome regulations that require states with routes of less than 750 miles to effectively act as rail carriers.
"Requiring a redundant layer of bureaucracy would not create improvements in passenger rail service or safety, it would only increase taxpayer costs," said INDOT Commissioner Karl Browning in a prepared statement. "Passenger rail providers and the host railroads are already required to comply with FRA rules."

In 2008, Congress voted to end funding for Amtrak routes of less than 750 miles."

If Congress ever, in a Bi partisan fashion were to change this (not Likely), and the vast majority of America Taxpayers wanted to pay for this (also not likely), then perhaps this warrants further discussion. But clearly this idea is dead.

[goofy328]

Originally Posted by WILWRadio

Well at some point that might work. Since the areas in between Cincy and Dayton are growing, it might be somewhat cost effective to develop a passenger rail line between the two cities in a decade or two.

Seems to me the most cost effective way to implement more rail for passenger service is to share existing rail lines with the freight companies. Freight should get the right of way but passenger trains could run when they won't impact freight trains.

Interesting that you say that because where I live in Virginia now that is the approach they're taking (with the old freight lines). These lines have been out of commission for many years, but the idea is the same.