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Old 05-16-2022, 11:41 AM
 
Location: Where clams are a pizza topping
524 posts, read 246,606 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Grlzrl View Post
I am begging you not to put your 4 year old on meds. Get him outside to play. A LOT. Be careful of getting a bunch of doctors/healthcare givers/therapists. It's expensive and at 4.5, way too soon. If you want to PM me, go ahead. I have an ADHD daughter and we put them on meds and they stunted her growth, made her look like a concentration camp victim and didn't help at the end of the day. I found out later that the nationwide chapter of ADHD support was funded by the pharmaceutical industry. This is an industry and your family will possibly waste huge amounts of money on this stuff that isn't needed.
I agree that 4 years old is rather young for medication. I'm not sure what age your daughter is, but by the time mine was diagnosed (she is a teenager now), medication before age 6 was no longer recommended; behavioral therapy and parent training are recommended before age 6, and medication (if needed) after age 6. My daughter didn't start medication until she was 11, and that was after years of trying every alternative and nutritional therapy we could find. With medication, she is still constantly on the move, but she able to focus in school and play two competitive sports. Yes, her appetite is effected by the medication, but the advantage with older kids is that they can understand that they can't skip meals even if they aren't hungry.
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Old 06-27-2022, 08:38 AM
 
7,348 posts, read 4,134,790 times
Reputation: 16811
Quote:
Originally Posted by Grlzrl View Post
Ugh. I am going to say some unpopular things here but I am going to say them.

My kids are now 16 and 18 and I have learned a lot about the 'system'. Everyone and their brother has an IEP or a 504. All these kids have problems? Or maybe they 'system' needs a lot of kids to have problems to keep the 'system' in place. A huge amount of money is sloshing around this system. Psychiatrists, psychologists, meds, special ed teachers, executive functioning coaches, therapists, etc., etc. What happens to all these people if we don't have screwed up kids? That's right. No more $$. NOTHING you said about your son implies to me that he needs to be medicated.
My daughter has bad ADHD. Her school repeatedly suggested medication. We never put her on medication. She always said she was happy with our decision. Her school years would have been easier with medication, but she wouldn't have been the same person. There is something about not making your kid into a clog in a machine. It's acceptance of the whole person.

Schools want clogs with high test scores in order to get the best rating. Additionally, schools want the most funding and spec ed kids increase funding from the federal government.

Schools are a business like another business. Your kid is a means to their successful business model - nothing more.
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Old 06-27-2022, 07:16 PM
 
17,183 posts, read 22,921,959 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by YorktownGal View Post
My daughter has bad ADHD. Her school repeatedly suggested medication. We never put her on medication. She always said she was happy with our decision. Her school years would have been easier with medication, but she wouldn't have been the same person. There is something about not making your kid into a clog in a machine. It's acceptance of the whole person.

Schools want clogs with high test scores in order to get the best rating. Additionally, schools want the most funding and spec ed kids increase funding from the federal government.

Schools are a business like another business. Your kid is a means to their successful business model - nothing more.
So if your child has diabetes, you will not give her medication? No medication for heartburn? No allergy medication ever?
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Old 06-27-2022, 07:54 PM
 
7,348 posts, read 4,134,790 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nana053 View Post
So if your child has diabetes, you will not give her medication? No medication for heartburn? No allergy medication ever?
ADHD is not a disease. Untreated - it does not progress.

Diabetes is a disease. Untreated - it progresses and can cause death.

Big difference!

If I have a learning difference like I'm bad at math or can't spell - is that a disease? Of course, not.

Neither is ADHD. It's a different wiring of the brain.
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Old 06-27-2022, 08:03 PM
 
17,183 posts, read 22,921,959 times
Reputation: 17478
Quote:
Originally Posted by YorktownGal View Post
ADHD is not a disease. Untreated - it does not progress.

Diabetes is a disease. Untreated - it progresses and can cause death.

Big difference!

If I have a learning difference like I'm bad at math or can't spell - is that a disease? Of course, not.

Neither is ADHD. It's a different wiring of the brain.

What about allergies or heartburn then?
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Old 06-27-2022, 08:07 PM
 
17,183 posts, read 22,921,959 times
Reputation: 17478
Quote:
Originally Posted by YorktownGal View Post
ADHD is not a disease. Untreated - it does not progress.

Diabetes is a disease. Untreated - it progresses and can cause death.

Big difference!

If I have a learning difference like I'm bad at math or can't spell - is that a disease? Of course, not.

Neither is ADHD. It's a different wiring of the brain.
ADHD doesn't go away though. And it does progress.

https://www.verywellmind.com/do-kids...son%27s%20life.

ADHD changes over time, but it's rarely outgrown

ADHD does not go away, usually. It was once thought that children would grow out of ADHD as they developed and matured. We now know that ADHD symptoms can continue into adolescence and beyond—throughout a person's life. While some kids may seem to outgrow the disorder (or no longer have symptoms that result in impairment), in most cases kids with ADHD grow up to be adults with ADHD.

Though ADHD is chronic in nature, symptoms may present in differing ways as a person moves through life stages. These symptoms may even diminish as that person grows older—for example, ​hyperactivity and fidgetiness may decrease with age.3

As well, teens and adults whose ADHD has been addressed over the years will have a range of resources and strategies to turn to when ADHD symptoms become problematic.

2:33
Watch Now: Strategies for Living Well With ADHD
ADHD Persists Into Adulthood
Research suggests that while symptoms may change as people grow older, people who have ADHD in childhood are often still affected by the condition in adulthood. However, estimates vary as to how many people still have persistent symptoms and impairment in adulthood.

In one study that followed children diagnosed with ADHD into adulthood, researchers found that:1

29% of people diagnosed in childhood had ADHD symptoms as adults.
81% of those with adult ADHD also had at least one other psychiatric condition.
Common co-occurring disorders seen in adulthood included substance use disorders, anxiety, and depression.
Of all the children participating in the study, only 37.5% were free of symptoms or negative outcomes in adulthood. The results also indicated that the participants had higher rates of incarceration and suicide as adults.

Another study published in The Journal of Child Psychology and Psychiatry found that 60% of kids with ADHD still had symptoms as adults, and 41% had symptoms that created impairment.2

Research conducted by the National Human Genome Research Project found that ADHD does not go away for between 20% and 30% of people with the condition.4 While the study found that the condition persists for many, it also showed that around half of adults experience fewer or less severe symptoms in adulthood.
When Does ADHD Peak?
One older study found that ADHD symptoms are often worse in kids aged 6 to 8 and gradually decline around age 11. Symptoms of hyperactivity and impulsivity were more likely to decline with age, while symptoms of inattention were likely to persist.5

Diagnosed at a Later Age
Many people with ADHD may not be diagnosed until their teenage or adult years. This is particularly true of those with predominately inattentive symptoms, which are less disruptive and overt as compared to impulsive/hyperactive symptoms.6

Girls and women, in particular, are more likely to experience the inattentive type of ADHD. This often means that they are diagnosed later in life. Research suggests that because these symptoms are less noticeable, girls develop coping strategies to help hide their symptoms.7

Though children may be able to successfully manage symptoms, the teenage and adult years bring on increased demands for sustained attention, planning, organization, and self-management that can make coping with ADHD more and more difficult.

People who are diagnosed as teens or adults may find a sense of relief in the diagnosis, which explains a wide range of lifelong challenges.

It can be particularly helpful to learn that there are both medical treatments and strategies that can make a positive difference. In addition, having a diagnosis can open the door to helpful conversations with parents, friends, and partners.

Teens With ADHD
Teens with untreated ADHD have few tools and resources for managing their symptoms. As a result, they are more likely than their typical peers to have difficulty juggling multiple classes and extracurricular activities.

Like other teens, teens with ADHD are separating from family and becoming more independent—but with fewer internal restraints, teens with ADHD are more likely to get involved in risky behavior.8 All these challenges can lead to injury and/or lowered self-esteem.

Teens with untreated ADHD are more likely to experience a higher incidence of driving accidents, underachievement in school/work, relationship problems, and even substance abuse.8

Adults With ADHD
Researchers have also found that structural differences in the brain persist into adulthood, even in cases where people previously diagnosed with ADHD no longer met the diagnostic criteria for the condition.9

Such findings suggest that while ADHD symptoms may become less apparent as someone grows older, they may still experience a variety of neurological differences that can influence behavior in a variety of ways.

Symptoms in adulthood can be more varied and present in more subtle ways—some examples include:

Disorganization
Impulsive decision-making
Internal restlessness
Wandering attention
Procrastination
Though symptoms may be less visible, they can be just as impairing. For example, adults with ADHD may have difficulty managing work tasks or respond impulsively in situations requiring self-restraint and tact.10 This can lead to more frequent job changes or unemployment. They may also have a difficult time maintaining long-term friendships and romantic relationships.
Does ADHD Get Worse With Age?
Symptoms may affect adults differently, but they typically do not grow worse with age. Adults also generally have more coping skills and resources to manage their symptoms as they age.

A Word From Verywell
While symptoms of ADHD often change with age and may become less severe in adulthood, the condition does not necessarily go away. While researchers are still learning more about why ADHD persists for many people, the evidence does suggest that getting a diagnosis and treatment as early as possible can improve outcomes.11

Whether you were diagnosed in childhood or recently learned that you have adult ADHD, talking to your doctor and getting appropriate treatment can help you manage your symptoms and improve your ability to function in your daily life.
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Old 06-28-2022, 10:51 AM
 
Location: Where clams are a pizza topping
524 posts, read 246,606 times
Reputation: 1544
^^This. It’s not just about school performance or conforming to the school environment. My daughter also struggled to keep friends and managing daily living, and her impulsivity put her in some very dangerous situations. One year, she had so many trips to urgent care that I was terrified of being flagged for CPS.
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Old 06-28-2022, 07:07 PM
 
26,142 posts, read 31,189,782 times
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Here, this is something I recently discovered about myself. There is a problem with diagnosing in psychiatry. They only identify disorders in the negative and things such as this are never considered. Keep in mind this does not pertain to academic giftedness nor IQ although it can be a part. We could never figure out why I was not hyperactive but the Ritalin worked in focus. It was information focus. There is a great deal of information about Emotional, Spiritual, and Cognitive Giftedness.

Can behavior problems be a sign of giftedness?
Yes, it can be. Some gifted children are mistakenly suspected of having ADHD, autism, or another condition with behavioral elements. Along with other gifted characteristics, many gifted children have sensory sensitivities. Such kids may become exhausted by classroom noise...

SIGNS OF EMOTIONAL GIFTEDNESS
(Yes it's recognized but is not in a DSM)

https://www.abcontario.ca/resources-...t%3B%20More%20
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Old 06-29-2022, 05:46 AM
 
7,348 posts, read 4,134,790 times
Reputation: 16811
Quote:
Originally Posted by Thursday007 View Post
Here, this is something I recently discovered about myself. There is a problem with diagnosing in psychiatry. They only identify disorders in the negative and things such as this are never considered. Keep in mind this does not pertain to academic giftedness nor IQ although it can be a part. We could never figure out why I was not hyperactive but the Ritalin worked in focus. It was information focus. There is a great deal of information about Emotional, Spiritual, and Cognitive Giftedness.

Can behavior problems be a sign of giftedness?
Yes, it can be. Some gifted children are mistakenly suspected of having ADHD, autism, or another condition with behavioral elements. Along with other gifted characteristics, many gifted children have sensory sensitivities. Such kids may become exhausted by classroom noise...

SIGNS OF EMOTIONAL GIFTEDNESS
(Yes it's recognized but is not in a DSM)

https://www.abcontario.ca/resources-...t%3B%20More%20
My cousin had this. It was a real issue. He was tested all the way back in the 1960's when few kids were test. He never paid attention in class. It turned out he picked up material so fast, he completely bored. He spent 12 years staring out the classroom window.

If you look at - we all have some type of learning disability. I'm sure Einstein as smart as he was had his mental limitations too. No one is perfect. So you have to figure out, how to you help people to live outside our narrow spectrum of normal. I happen to put a big emphasis on learning and accepting one's self without drugs. Not that drugs can't be helpful, but other coping devices should not be ignored.
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Old 10-17-2022, 01:36 PM
 
1 posts, read 499 times
Reputation: 10
Default ADHD Update?

My son is 7 and sounds identical as your now as well when he was younger. Since this was back in 2015, I'm wondering if you have any updates on your son's progress and if you found anything that works.

-Chris




Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthIsland View Post
Hi folks,

Looking for some insight and some guidance from parents of or ADHD folks.

My son is 4 1/2, he's always been on the move, and been hyperactive, doesn't listen to some of our rules. His nursery school teacher suggested we have him evaluated. We saw an occupational therapist and the a child psychologist. The first doc says he's borderline for receiving assistance but based on her review he will not qualify. She thinks he has some fine motor skill development delay. However, he is extremely smart and is overcoming the problem. Psychologist did a 1 hour assessment. Also says he scores off the charts in smarts but has "classic" ADHD symptoms. Says we should see MD and put him on meds. A real shock to us and we are very concerned. We are not anti drug, but we do think drugs are often overprescribed and its the go to answer for many. Of course if he really needs it, we would put him on the meds but I am very unsure about it.

I've been researching, and from all the clinical descriptions of ADHD he has a few strong symptoms on the list but not too many. So I am not sure if he's just a tough boy to manage or if he has ADHD.

Here's the behaviors what I've observed, not in any particular order.


Based on many typical symptoms:
1. Does pay very good attention to details, although I only observed this with things he's interested in, not sure if he is attentive to things that are not of interest. But he does remember many things I say, things we do, things I would not expect a 4 YO to remember or notice.
2. Stays focused on things he likes, will pay hours on certain toys.
3. Can follow simple instructions but many times forget or ignore a routine such as don't run in the house or don't suck on fingers.
4. Can put together big puzzles on his own.
5. Sits still when watching TV, watching videos. Squirms at the dinner table, runs everywhere.
6. Seems oblivious to other people when he runs.
7. Talks a lot but not what I think is excessive, does interrupt often but will also sit quietly on occasion and just listen.
8. Temper is ok, not too many tantrums.
9. Loves to hug, 0 aggression.
10. Is impulsive.
11. Walks up to and starts talking to other kids, strangers.
12. Can do simple math.

So you may be seeing that he has several symptoms but other symptoms are quite the opposite of ADHD. I would think he would exhibit at least a low level of many of the symptoms but several items he does not do at all. I do not know if ADHD means you have a majority of the symptoms some stronger than others or if some symptoms can be non-existent and you can still have ADHD?

For instance he can spend quite a bit of time coloring or cutting things out but when he gets frustrated there is no tantrum? Sometimes he does tantrum over very minor offenses but there is always a cause. He does not just melt down for no reason. He does not fidgit when playing, all his moves are methodical and "normal" for the course of play. He does run everywhere and loves to flop on the ground.

When I ask he he knows not to run he says yes but he can't control himself.
He was sucking his fingers as a pacifier up until 2 weeks ago but had a big cut on one finger. The bandaid seems to have finally stopped the finger sucking. I would think if he could not control this he would start to suck the fingers then move them away as it would be more involuntary but I do not see that behavior, it seems to have been forgotten altogether.

So my question is this, can he "score" 8's and 9's on several symptoms and score 0 on many others and still have ADHD? Or would he score at least 3-4 on the majority of symptoms? Also if he has only 6 out of 20 symptoms, would that be considered ADHD?

Any insight would be very helpful. Thanks!!
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