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If maintained - it doesn't have an end of life unless the maintenance costs become prohibitively expense - and I don't see that happening unless something catastrophic like an even worse earthquake than 1989 (much of SF didn't have damage from the 1906 earthquake - it was the subsequent fire that destroyed most of the city.
By your logic - we shouldn't have any standing buildings earlier than the 1920's.
The Moana Surfrider was built in 1901 - should everyone be evacuated?
I am sure the Surfrider was built to the standards of the day. I doubt that it would meet today's building codes and is grandfathered.
As long as moisture doesn't reach the structural steel buildings should remain safe. Unfortunately that isn't easy to prevent or detect. In modern buildings steel is treated with coatings that greatly extend it's life. The current products were not available even 20 years ago.
The Ritz Carlton residences in San Francisco were built in 1888. Survived the 1906 earthquake (although damaged) - served as headquarters to the San Francisco Chronicle - used as an office building - and ultimately a Ritz Carlton residences in 2007.
Point being - you don't build condos with an end of life target of 40-50 years. Properly designed and maintained buildings do not have end of life targets when built.
Last edited by whtviper1; 06-30-2021 at 02:13 PM..
The Ritz Carlton residences in San Francisco were built in 1888. Survived the 1906 earthquake (although damaged) - served as headquarters to the San Francisco Chronicles - used as an office building - and ultimately a Ritz Carlton residences in 2007.
Point being - you don't build condos with an end of life target of 40-50 years. Properly designed and maintained buildings do not have end of life targets when built.
Perhaps they will be around forever, except the ones that fall down.
I think it is a little premature to announce the death of all steel/concrete framed buildings over 50 yrs old. Especially based on only one event out of all the buildings in this country. Particularly when that one building appears to have had
construction & engineering issues and what sounds like pretty constant and long term leakage into the structural support elements of the building.
This event should spur closer examination of these buildings for broader signs of problems, and from that we'll know if this is a widespread issue, or a more isolated problem resulting from poor design/construction and maintenance.
But at this point, I feel one building with problems is too little to draw any conclusions about other buildings or the integrity of older steel/concrete buildings in general.
I think it's fair to assume that all high-rise buildings will face higher insurance costs and more thorough inspections after the ONE collapse, whether justified or not.
I think it's fair to assume that all high-rise buildings will face higher insurance costs and more thorough inspections after the ONE collapse, whether justified or not.
OK, so this thread got me thinking more about my own building. I know it is pretty well maintained in general. But I admit I don't know much about the issues and maintenance requirements of a large building. So I pulled out my 20-year reserve study. I see one of our regular projects is Exterior Painting & spalling repair every 7 years. And they just completed last year spalling repair and new waterproofing for the loading dock area.
I think beyond assuming that "others" will now be inspired to examine these issues with their larger steel & concrete buildings, it should be a wake up call for all owners to be more involved and start asking questions about their buildings.
I know it has compelled me to start asking more questions.
Did they mention what the approximate monthly increase in the HOA fee per unit will be based on the revised $4.5 mil cost & loan terms ?
Also, did they mention why the bid is now 30% lower than before ? Smaller scope of work, different contractor, etc ?
These aging mini high rise buildings require a lot of maintanence. I always cringe when I see the annual forecast for future planned projects.
Sometimes I can see the appeal of the 3-story cement block walk ups !!
They were throwing out ballpark figures but a lot was based on the term of the loan. They are offering a 25 year loan, so fees cited were actually reasonable, but there are still several options to choose from. I don't recall the exact amount cited, but a lot of it was not of much use to me as they were looking at things as if we all would pay the same amount.
Also, they didn't mention why the bid is so much lower at this meeting, but could have at previous meetings. I have only dialed into two of these meetings due to the time zone differences, but generally always try to dial into the town-hall style meetings. I'd guess that they were able to actually get into a unit and better assess how much work they need to do, but again that's just my guess.
Yeah, no doubt on the maintenance issues. I will say that a lot of the regular work such as roof replacement, regular painting (which can help ensure the structural integrity of the building as the paint used acts as a sealant) can go a long way to keeping prices lower than otherwise in the long term. But some buildings don't even do that and have the deal with the results.
That is a very good read for anyone who is interested. It gives a good snapshot at the expenses that unit owners in these buildings face over the years.
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