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View Poll Results: Your opinion of wolf restoration
Just great, in just about every wilderness 10 66.67%
Great, but let's keep it to Yellowstone and Idaho 3 20.00%
Get rid of them, again 2 13.33%
Others, and people who voted, post away! 0 0%
Voters: 15. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-30-2023, 08:57 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa View Post
More likely, those wolves were dispersed from Glacier National Park and environs, where they were never totally eliminated.
Fair point.

A more accurate statement on my point would be that there were wolves in Yellowstone prior to the official reintroduction.
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Old 06-30-2023, 11:24 AM
 
Location: New York Area
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mathguy View Post
Fair point.

A more accurate statement on my point would be that there were wolves in Yellowstone prior to the official reintroduction.
There was actually some discussion about that. The concern was lack of sufficient animals to ensure breeding. I followed the news avidly. Now, there are dispersed animals, likely from Idaho, as far as California.
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Old 06-30-2023, 06:47 PM
 
Location: Everywhere.
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Wolves are an important part of the ecosystem. The Yellowstone wolf reintroduction program has for the most part been successful. There are believed to be around 9 wolf packs that inhabit Yellowstone NP at this time. Mountain lions are predators, just like wolves. Don’t see any reason for their population to be strictly controlled.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=gc52l5...9kdWNlZA%3D%3D
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Old 06-30-2023, 07:13 PM
 
Location: NW Nevada
18,161 posts, read 15,659,304 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Star691 View Post
Wolves are an important part of the ecosystem. The Yellowstone wolf reintroduction program has for the most part been successful. There are believed to be around 9 wolf packs that inhabit Yellowstone NP at this time. Mountain lions are predators, just like wolves. Don’t see any reason for their population to be strictly controlled.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=gc52l5...9kdWNlZA%3D%3D
Mmmm. Yes. I'm not to awful positive sure I like the idea of wolf populations growing and spreading out. I don't want them here. I think wolves are a way cool critter but I don't want them anywhere near my stock. here's this coywolf thing going on back East I've been following some and that thought of a critter like that skulking about my digs does give me trepidation.

It seems unlikely that a breeding population of coywolves will see hybrids packing up together at least. They seem to be loners not accepted by either side. Lets hope it stays that way. I'm still not a huge rah rah for the wolf reintro programs going on. Anytime man messes with nature even if that road to hell is fully paved with good intentions it never seems to work out well. I'd rather see buffalo darkening the plains with their bodies again truth be told than wolves roaming about.

Wolves don't scare me as in I won't go into the wilds if they are there. I'm not fretting getting attacked by a pack of wolves. But a pack getting into calving time does scare me. Wolves are very shy with people oriented things though. Coyotes have no such qualms. They seek people out. As predators go I have to say I think coyotes are more of a threat for folks like us than wolves would be if they were here in numbers. but I'd rather not find out for certain. Feral and coy dogs are a nasty problem at times and I'd rather not add wolves to the already potent mix we have.

A certain amount of predator loss is expected and part of life but that doesn't mean we like it. Wolves can just stay up North. I'm good with that.
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Old 06-30-2023, 08:03 PM
 
Location: New York Area
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I waded into a pack of animals that were 98% wolf. Took courage.



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Old 06-30-2023, 10:13 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa View Post
Wolves are pack animals, and extremely intelligent. They learn from what happens to their pack-mates.

They may be smarter than some humans. The knee-jerk theory that killing wolves is necessary to keep them afraid has little to back it up but folk wisdom. Most wolves are already afraid of people and do not bother people. The ones that are habituated and hanging around humans are usually lone wolves, so the pack isn't usually going to know or care or learn anything when one disappears. Habituating wolves is a very bad idea.

Meanwhile recent science suggests that killing wolves may be counterproductive, because it disrupts the pack stability and leads to an increase in breeding, and wolf predation on livestock actually increases after wolf hunts. Only removing unsustainable numbers of wolves leads to a decrease in livestock depredation.

So learning to live with them and only removing problematic individuals is actually the better strategy than hunting.
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Old 07-01-2023, 12:53 AM
 
Location: New York Area
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deserterer View Post
They may be smarter than some humans. The knee-jerk theory that killing wolves is necessary to keep them afraid has little to back it up but folk wisdom. Most wolves are already afraid of people and do not bother people. The ones that are habituated and hanging around humans are usually lone wolves, so the pack isn't usually going to know or care or learn anything when one disappears. Habituating wolves is a very bad idea.

Meanwhile recent science suggests that killing wolves may be counterproductive, because it disrupts the pack stability and leads to an increase in breeding, and wolf predation on livestock actually increases after wolf hunts. Only removing unsustainable numbers of wolves leads to a decrease in livestock depredation.

So learning to live with them and only removing problematic individuals is actually the better strategy than hunting.
Good post but I just don't agree. It is counterintuitive. Where I live, in suburban New York City area, the deer, squirrels and even some birds have lost their fear of man, since we don't kill or injure them. They would avoid a cat or maybe even a dog.

Somehow, species develop a bank of knowledge of what they need to fear and what is harmless. When apex predators are involved, humans should never be known to be harmless, even as we reintroduce them.
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Old 07-01-2023, 07:25 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa View Post
Good post but I just don't agree. It is counterintuitive. Where I live, in suburban New York City area, the deer, squirrels and even some birds have lost their fear of man, since we don't kill or injure them. They would avoid a cat or maybe even a dog.

Somehow, species develop a bank of knowledge of what they need to fear and what is harmless. When apex predators are involved, humans should never be known to be harmless, even as we reintroduce them.

Evolution and a spherical earth are counterintuitive too.

If hunting wolves is necessary to keep them from being a threat to humans, then wolves would be aggressive toward humans in places they aren't hunted and that isn't the case. Almost all cases of wolves even getting close to people in places like National Parks, where hunting and usually carrying firearms isn't even allowed, are non-aggressive and often the result of idiots habituating wolves. We do want wolves to remain fearful of humans. If they get too close the smartest thing to do is make noise, yell, throw something (if necessary), etc. We don't want them to think humans are afraid, or harmless.
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Old 07-02-2023, 07:02 AM
 
Location: Maine
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I think I've recommended this here in the past. Some of you might be interested in the book American Wolf by Nate Blakeslee. It's a story of reintroducing wolves and how it affects nature's balance and humans.
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Old 07-02-2023, 09:06 AM
 
Location: NW Nevada
18,161 posts, read 15,659,304 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbgusa View Post
I waded into a pack of animals that were 98% wolf. Took courage.


Oh man that's just cruel. I've got a dog wanting going on right now that puts Billy Coleman to shame. And you put up pics of puppies. . I even see the one I'd pick. Now look whatcha done did. Now all I can think about is a wiggly silly puppy making my day with entertaining antics. (sigh)
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