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Old 09-25-2023, 08:02 AM
pdw
 
Location: Ontario, Canada
2,674 posts, read 3,090,748 times
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Don’t safe injection sites get people off the streets? Unless you want someone on a street corner lying on the sidewalk with a needle sticking out of their arm, it seems like a win/win. A lot of the people frequenting there are probably homeless, yes, so there might be more of a homeless presence in the area, but the way to improve that is better housing policies. So far no government at any level seems to have the balls to actually build social housing and increase the volume of public housing available but it would be the best way to fix the homelessness crisis. Unfortunately it’s not compatible with the neoliberal ideology of private sector solutions being the only way, so we’re not gonna see the Liberals or Conservatives make any plans to do it.
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Old 09-25-2023, 08:03 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
26,873 posts, read 37,997,315 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pdw View Post
Don’t safe injection sites get people off the streets? Unless you want someone on a street corner lying on the sidewalk with a needle sticking out of their arm, it seems like a win/win. A lot of the people frequenting there are probably homeless, yes, so there might be more of a homeless presence in the area, but the way to improve that is better housing policies. So far no government at any level seems to have the balls to actually build social housing and increase the volume of public housing available but it would be the best way to fix the homelessness crisis. Unfortunately it’s not compatible with the neoliberal ideology of private sector solutions being the only way, so we’re not gonna see the Liberals or Conservatives make any plans to do it.
It only gets them off the streets for a very short period of time, though. They get their fix and then they're back out on the streets.
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Old 09-25-2023, 08:42 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
26,873 posts, read 37,997,315 times
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Originally Posted by fusion2 View Post
More needs to be done to study the links. I suspect though that there are other issues at play that are probably more responsible

Increased number of individuals who have mental health issues - the pandemic exacerbated this.

Cost of living and housing issues are going to put more on the streets and those on the streets are more likely to want to find an escape from their grim reality.

The drugs themselves have changed. They are much more addictive and deadly.

So I think we should be looking more at those issues. Getting rid of safe injection sites will not make these more macro level issues go away.
I often wonder if safe injection sites and freer access actually help get people off drugs eventually, or if it just means they'll die of an overdose in a year or two as opposed to six months from now.

Also, most Canadians including residents of cities aren't hard drug users and these people also have a right to feel safe and not be threatened in their communities.

This needs to be factored into the equation.
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Old 09-25-2023, 08:57 AM
 
Location: Canada
7,306 posts, read 9,314,019 times
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
I often wonder if safe injection sites and freer access actually help get people off drugs eventually, or if it just means they'll die of an overdose in a year or two as opposed to six months from now.

Also, most Canadians including residents of cities aren't hard drug users and these people also have a right to feel safe and not be threatened in their communities.

This needs to be factored into the equation.

I haven't done research into whether getting them off the streets was the purpose - I thought the purpose was to give them a safer solution to what they were doing anyway.

According to the 2014 study it saved lives. Now maybe non drug users would rather they die? I don't mean that in a snarky way. Cities are going to have homeless people and drug users. They will be in downtown areas. Whether there are safe injection sites or not although obviously they will congregate around those sites. The study found no increase in crime. There may be an increase in homeless people and addicts but not as a result of the safe sites.

So what is the solution?

I don't agree that a lax approach to drugs is to blame. There wasn't always a lax approach to drugs.
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Old 09-25-2023, 09:07 AM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
26,873 posts, read 37,997,315 times
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Originally Posted by netwit View Post
I haven't done research into whether getting them off the streets was the purpose - I thought the purpose was to give them a safer solution to what they were doing anyway.

According to the 2014 study it saved lives. Now maybe non drug users would rather they die? I don't mean that in a snarky way. Cities are going to have homeless people and drug users. They will be in downtown areas. Whether there are safe injection sites or not although obviously they will congregate around those sites. The study found no increase in crime. There may be an increase in homeless people and addicts but not as a result of the safe sites.

So what is the solution?

I don't agree that a lax approach to drugs is to blame. There wasn't always a lax approach to drugs.
Correlation is not causation as they say, but it's a fact that the worsening of the situation has coincided with a loosening up of policies on drugs.
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Old 09-25-2023, 09:53 AM
 
Location: Dayton OH
5,759 posts, read 11,358,171 times
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Originally Posted by fusion2 View Post
Does this mean we'll have carnival in February
Does Winterlude in Ottawa count? Samba on ice?
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Old 09-25-2023, 10:45 AM
 
Location: Toronto
15,102 posts, read 15,862,695 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
I often wonder if safe injection sites and freer access actually help get people off drugs eventually, or if it just means they'll die of an overdose in a year or two as opposed to six months from now.

Also, most Canadians including residents of cities aren't hard drug users and these people also have a right to feel safe and not be threatened in their communities.

This needs to be factored into the equation.
So without these sites you think they wouldn't continue their addictions and the death rate would be lower? I mean if you're addicted you'll get your fix regardless except there will be less supports. I highly doubt these sites would increase recidivism. In terms of communities feeling safe, they are still going to be around in the community regardless if there are safe injection sites. If you get rid of the sites you don't get rid of the person with the addiction. They don't magically disappear. Wouldn't one factor that into the equation.
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Old 09-25-2023, 10:47 AM
 
Location: Toronto
15,102 posts, read 15,862,695 times
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Originally Posted by recycled View Post
Does Winterlude in Ottawa count? Samba on ice?
lol i imagine you'd have to be really skilled to be able to do Samba on ICE.. In addition to a decline in Standard of Living - I wouldn't want people to be breaking bones more

I've never been to winterlude though I don't think it would have the same energy as Carnival in Brazil. I could be wrong
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Old 09-25-2023, 12:10 PM
 
Location: Canada
7,306 posts, read 9,314,019 times
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Correlation is not causation as they say, but it's a fact that the worsening of the situation has coincided with a loosening up of policies on drugs.
The War on Drugs in the US would ssy otherwise https://civilrights.org/edfund/resou...mmission-says/
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Old 09-25-2023, 01:10 PM
 
Location: Gatineau, Québec
26,873 posts, read 37,997,315 times
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Originally Posted by netwit View Post
The War on Drugs in the US would ssy otherwise https://civilrights.org/edfund/resou...mmission-says/
This report is from 2011 though.
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