Burlington becoming Portland East? (Jamaica: home, school, tax)

[mikeugh]

Originally Posted by NYLIER

I guess you feel only you are entitled to an opinion. So you state out of one side of your mouth that Burlington is doing "okay", but then the rest of your post you list all the problems, which are quite a few.

As far as FOX news, maybe you should watch it more often because you are the one with the political chip on your shoulders. It is quite obvious that Bernie has a huge influence on our state or it wouldn't be controlled in the socialist way it is. But people like yourself will continue to keep their head in the sand and allow all the negatives you mentioned only get worse.

Please don't criticize people for giving their honest opinions. It isn't very nice.

They didn't really list any problems. Not any that don't occur everywhere.

But when you start lumping Senator Sanders, who in the 70s would be considered a mainstream democrat, with socialism, which is laughable, you're not going to sway many people. Social democracy and socialism aren't very close to one another in political science respects. And Vermont is quite far from being run in a socialist way.

[Champ le monstre du lac]

Originally Posted by NYLIER

I guess you feel only you are entitled to an opinion. So you state out of one side of your mouth that Burlington is doing "okay", but then the rest of your post you list all the problems, which are quite a few.

As far as FOX news, maybe you should watch it more often because you are the one with the political chip on your shoulders. It is quite obvious that Bernie has a huge influence on our state or it wouldn't be controlled in the socialist way it is. But people like yourself will continue to keep their head in the sand and allow all the negatives you mentioned only get worse.

Please don't criticize people for giving their honest opinions. It isn't very nice.

The problem here is you characterized Burlington as "trashed" and that is not an honest assessment. That's just an armchair opinion given from a distance in NY or wherever it may be (clearly you're not here), compared to actual recent experience with the city. Why would I watch FOX news or CNN/MSNBC for that matter? It's all garbage and angled to paint a useless scapegoating narrative in which you're clearly following.

I acknowledge there are problems in the city (like any city), that's not head in the sand. You just happened to take it to a melodramatic level (like cable news networks often do) and it's disingenuous on your end. I did have prior concerns on the city heading in the wrong direction and ending up trashed to a worst case scenario like Portland, Oregon with homeless camps downtown and rampant open air drug use. From what I've seen on the ground in Burlington in recent months, that's not really the case.

But, somehow watching Fox news would enlighten me or anyone else? Pffftt... No wonder why you think the sky is falling there. You're missing the point, that both the left and the right are both getting it wrong and neither side have proven to have any effective solutions. The predictable and cumbersome " it's all the left's fault" or "the right is evil" is nonsense that serves no meaningful purpose and that's what head in the sand really is and only allows the problems to perpetuate.

In the meantime, I've been spending a lot of time in Burlington recently and you can certainly have an opinion on it. That doesn't mean you won't be called out for being wrong or exaggerating from what Burlington is really like that's clearly stated from a one sided narrative with an agenda from a NY armchair and not in Vermont. Sorry, not sorry, but your opinion is not immune from being criticized when it doesn't paint an accurate picture.

[NYLIER]

Originally Posted by mikeugh

They didn't really list any problems. Not any that don't occur everywhere.

But when you start lumping Senator Sanders, who in the 70s would be considered a mainstream democrat, with socialism, which is laughable, you're not going to sway many people. Social democracy and socialism aren't very close to one another in political science respects. And Vermont is quite far from being run in a socialist way.

I'm not trying to "sway" anyone. You are the only person I have heard feel that way and you are entitled to your opinion as much as I and everyone else that feels it is a socialist state. Sanders admitted that he is a socialist.

Who is "they"? Are you referring to the gentleman that rattled on about all the problems with Burlington and then said there weren't any? You didn't find that "laughable"?

[NYLIER]

Originally Posted by Champ le monstre du lac

The problem here is you characterized Burlington as "trashed" and that is not an honest assessment. That's just an armchair opinion given from a distance in NY or wherever it may be (clearly you're not here), compared to actual recent experience with the city. Why would I watch FOX news or CNN/MSNBC for that matter? It's all garbage and angled to paint a useless scapegoating narrative in which you're clearly following.

I acknowledge there are problems in the city (like any city), that's not head in the sand. You just happened to take it to a melodramatic level (like cable news networks often do) and it's disingenuous on your end. I did have prior concerns on the city heading in the wrong direction and ending up trashed to a worst case scenario like Portland, Oregon with homeless camps downtown and rampant open air drug use. From what I've seen on the ground in Burlington in recent months, that's not really the case.

But, somehow watching Fox news would enlighten me or anyone else? Pffftt... No wonder why you think the sky is falling there. You're missing the point, that both the left and the right are both getting it wrong and neither side have proven to have any effective solutions. The predictable and cumbersome " it's all the left's fault" or "the right is evil" is nonsense that serves no meaningful purpose and that's what head in the sand really is and only allows the problems to perpetuate.

In the meantime, I've been spending a lot of time in Burlington recently and you can certainly have an opinion on it. That doesn't mean you won't be called out for being wrong or exaggerating from what Burlington is really like that's clearly stated from a one sided narrative with an agenda from a NY armchair and not in Vermont. Sorry, not sorry, but your opinion is not immune from being criticized when it doesn't paint an accurate picture.

Don't put words in my mouth. You are the one exaggerating. I've lived and paid my fair share of taxes to this state for over 20 years, so, not surprisingly, you are wrong again.
I think its funny that I said that I'm concerned about my daughter going on a bike ride after reading someone's post and you have labeled me the Villian of Burlington. Unfortunately, there are too many that use this forum to just be critical of others to boost their own egos. I've taken the bait too many times and this is as far as it is going, for me anyway. I totally agree to disagree with you. Burlington is a city, not my blood so it isn't worth arguing over. Have a splendid day, Champ.

[NYLIER]

Originally Posted by mikeugh

They didn't really list any problems. Not any that don't occur everywhere.

But when you start lumping Senator Sanders, who in the 70s would be considered a mainstream democrat, with socialism, which is laughable, you're not going to sway many people. Social democracy and socialism aren't very close to one another in political science respects. And Vermont is quite far from being run in a socialist way.

FYI, During the 1980 presidential election, Sanders served as one of three electors for the Socialist Workers Party in Vermont, which is a US Communist Party. I don't find this funny, but you might.

[Champ le monstre du lac]

Originally Posted by NYLIER

Who is "they"? Are you referring to the gentleman that rattled on about all the problems with Burlington and then said there weren't any? You didn't find that "laughable"?

So you accuse me of putting words in your mouth, when you're doing it right here. I never said there weren't problems at any point. I said you were exaggerating them when you called the city trashed. Take a walk around Burlington in spring 2023 and you'll see that's just nothing more than hyperbole on your end, and I see that you're not here presently to back up your statements. If you said Portland, OR was trashed you'd have a fair point. Burlington is not trashed and it's still a beautiful city and not a "once was" as you previously stated.

If you don't want to debate, then don't dump fuel on the fire and we can agree to disagree. You have a swell evening as well.

[mikeugh]

Originally Posted by NYLIER

FYI, During the 1980 presidential election, Sanders served as one of three electors for the Socialist Workers Party in Vermont, which is a US Communist Party. I don't find this funny, but you might.

I think its hilarious that you're harping on something from four decades ago.

If you knew anything about his involvement, it was to protest the CIA overthrow in Iran that led to the hostage crisis. FYI, Sanders was right. He usually is.

[Turnerbro]

lol hearing people in Vermont talk about crime..... Go to an actually dangerous city and you'll see the difference.....

[Riley.]

Originally Posted by Turnerbro

lol hearing people in Vermont talk about crime..... Go to an actually dangerous city and you'll see the difference.....

We know the difference, friend. We are concerned we may wind up like other liberal run cities.

[Champ le monstre du lac]

I used to live in Albuquerque, so yeah I obviously know the difference. To Riley's point, Burlington was getting trashy for a good while post pandemic, and crime was on an uptick last year like a lot of places so we weren't immune. Burlington is a beautiful city, like Portland used to be. We really don't want to emulate Portland.

I believe Burlington has turned a corner for the better in 2023. I go into the city every Thursday for an assignment and recently had a friend in town over the weekend for a visit when we had great weather. It's looking good and downtown was packed with people as were all the city parks. It was nice to see.

The downtown caters to tourists better than it does to locals, and there are some spots that are still tagged up. But from a broader perspective and as far as cities go, particularly small cities, Burlington's got it better than most.