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I have a teenager who isn't officially diagnosed with anything other than ADHD and anxiety. Physically, she looks like a normal teenager. When you first meet her you might even think she is a pretty typical person. This makes it so hard to figure out what is really going on with her. I understand that some of the below is typical for teenagers but it is hard to parse out what is normal and what is problematic. She has a first cousin her age and the cousin has said that she is "weird" to her grandmother in confidence. She was a very quiet baby. Would flap arms when excited and stare at you. Was an early reader and as she grew up I thought she was absolutely brilliant. We would even call her "the professor" because she knew so many things and would recite them from the non fiction books she would read. Then, around 4th grade it all changed. The grades became very inconsistent, she started freaking out over everything. She was even kicked off the cheer team because she had frequent meltdowns. Her hygiene was non-existent and she started picking her facial skin. we first brought her to a therapist and all she did was lie to the therapist so that went nowhere. Then we brought her to a pediatric neurologist who said she had ADHD and anxiety/depression. These are her attributes as a teenager:
She is a serial liar. Very argumentative and gets nasty when called out.
Extremely socially awkward - can not have a conversation with people. Brings up random things that have nothing to do with anything. Delusional and in her own world. lives vicariously through others, says things that happen differently than what actually happened. Makes up events that didn't happen and speaks about it like it is truth. For instance, "I have plans to hang out with a friend tonight" when no friends exist.
Can not follow instructions. does not follow through on tasks asked of her. disinterested, lacks empathy and sympathy, no situational*awareness, no passions or drives. everything she used to like as a young child she has absolutely no interest in. She is apathetic, shows no interest in people or affection towards them. Acts like she doesn't love or like anyone (even our dog). has to be constantly reminded of things. Has absolutely no initiative. No attempt to help out. cannot stay on task. For instance, she has basic tasks which she does do every day such as feed the dog and let her out but she has to be reminded to let the dog out and then let the dog back in. She is almost 15. inconsistent grades, will get 90s and then get zeros and 40s this is the primary reason why I do not think she will ever be able to hold down a job
poor memory. Can not recall events from her day or at least articulate them in a meaningful way.
no accountability, no ability to self reflect or admit when she wrong. it is always someone
elses fault
sensory issues (texture and food) cant wear jewelry
On the positives, she does put effort into her looks, clothing, and make up (it took years to get to this point. She keeps her room generally clean, She cares about her schoolwork. She checks the grade portal frequently and generally she wants to achieve, but always falls short because she doesn't put full effort into anything. she’s a rule follower she doesn’t get in trouble. She’s a very good kid otherwise. When she is off her meds you can tell immediately.
Honestly as a female she's going to have a hard up hill battle to get diagnosed on the ASD spectrum. (This has been my experience with myself and both my daughters). IMO some of the issues you are describing could be attributed to ADHD but it's also possible she has ASD. People with both conditions often have something called Pathological Demand Avoidance and Rejection Sensitivity. Basically they are very sensitive to criticism and hate being told what to do even if it's something they like to do. The challenge is getting them to become self aware of these issues so they can work on them. They'll never go away but can be managed.
Status:
"I don't understand. But I don't care, so it works out."
(set 2 days ago)
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The most concerning thing, is that she has no friends. Her age group is the most social they'll ever be - relying very closely on friendships to create most of their identity. That she literally has no one, indicates real social deficit, where the rest of her behaviors could just be self-centered adolescence.
Could her meds be causing some of her problems? I know anti-anxiety meds will often make the person just not care about a single thing, and will make them unwilling to engage in normal social behaviors.
I have a teenager who isn't officially diagnosed with anything other than ADHD and anxiety. Physically, she looks like a normal teenager. When you first meet her you might even think she is a pretty typical person. This makes it so hard to figure out what is really going on with her. I understand that some of the below is typical for teenagers but it is hard to parse out what is normal and what is problematic. She has a first cousin her age and the cousin has said that she is "weird" to her grandmother in confidence. She was a very quiet baby. Would flap arms when excited and stare at you. Was an early reader and as she grew up I thought she was absolutely brilliant. We would even call her "the professor" because she knew so many things and would recite them from the non fiction books she would read. Then, around 4th grade it all changed. The grades became very inconsistent, she started freaking out over everything. She was even kicked off the cheer team because she had frequent meltdowns. Her hygiene was non-existent and she started picking her facial skin. we first brought her to a therapist and all she did was lie to the therapist so that went nowhere. Then we brought her to a pediatric neurologist who said she had ADHD and anxiety/depression. These are her attributes as a teenager:
She is a serial liar. Very argumentative and gets nasty when called out.
Extremely socially awkward - can not have a conversation with people. Brings up random things that have nothing to do with anything. Delusional and in her own world. lives vicariously through others, says things that happen differently than what actually happened. Makes up events that didn't happen and speaks about it like it is truth. For instance, "I have plans to hang out with a friend tonight" when no friends exist.
Can not follow instructions. does not follow through on tasks asked of her. disinterested, lacks empathy and sympathy, no situational*awareness, no passions or drives. everything she used to like as a young child she has absolutely no interest in. She is apathetic, shows no interest in people or affection towards them. Acts like she doesn't love or like anyone (even our dog). has to be constantly reminded of things. Has absolutely no initiative. No attempt to help out. cannot stay on task. For instance, she has basic tasks which she does do every day such as feed the dog and let her out but she has to be reminded to let the dog out and then let the dog back in. She is almost 15. inconsistent grades, will get 90s and then get zeros and 40s this is the primary reason why I do not think she will ever be able to hold down a job
poor memory. Can not recall events from her day or at least articulate them in a meaningful way.
no accountability, no ability to self reflect or admit when she wrong. it is always someone
elses fault
sensory issues (texture and food) cant wear jewelry
On the positives, she does put effort into her looks, clothing, and make up (it took years to get to this point. She keeps her room generally clean, She cares about her schoolwork. She checks the grade portal frequently and generally she wants to achieve, but always falls short because she doesn't put full effort into anything. she’s a rule follower she doesn’t get in trouble. She’s a very good kid otherwise. When she is off her meds you can tell immediately.
Talk to a professional before assigning a label. Please and thank you.
The most concerning thing, is that she has no friends. Her age group is the most social they'll ever be - relying very closely on friendships to create most of their identity. That she literally has no one, indicates real social deficit, where the rest of her behaviors could just be self-centered adolescence.
Could her meds be causing some of her problems? I know anti-anxiety meds will often make the person just not care about a single thing, and will make them unwilling to engage in normal social behaviors.
she was never able to make friends before the meds either. at least with the meds she isn’t in a constant state of self-destruction. i think no one wants to be friends with here because she shows indifference towards other kids, constantly switching where she sits at lunch, talking about things no one cares about. she can’t even normally converse with her family. everything is just a random statement having nothing to do with anything. actually, this Christmas we were at family’s and there were 3 girls all close in age and she is sitting there all by herself while the rest of them interacted with each other. i walked over to her and said “why don’t you go with the other girls” the response was her yelling “i am with them!!” then the next day she told me about what fun she had last night seeing the girls, when she was by herself most of the night. one girl even went up to her and asked her if she wanted to go downstairs with them and she said “in a bit”it is truly heartbreaking.
Status:
"I don't understand. But I don't care, so it works out."
(set 2 days ago)
35,607 posts, read 17,927,273 times
Reputation: 50627
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kristinas_Cap
she was never able to make friends before the meds either. at least with the meds she isn’t in a constant state of self-destruction. i think no one wants to be friends with here because she shows indifference towards other kids, constantly switching where she sits at lunch, talking about things no one cares about. she can’t even normally converse with her family. everything is just a random statement having nothing to do with anything. actually, this Christmas we were at family’s and there were 3 girls all close in age and she is sitting there all by herself while the rest of them interacted with each other. i walked over to her and said “why don’t you go with the other girls” the response was her yelling “i am with them!!” then the next day she told me about what fun she had last night seeing the girls, when she was by herself most of the night. one girl even went up to her and asked her if she wanted to go downstairs with them and she said “in a bit”it is truly heartbreaking.
As sad as this looks to you, it does seem she really truly doesn't care to interact with her peers. There are girls who try desperately to be liked by peers, and are rejected, and live miserably. She doesn't seem to be experiencing that - she doesn't interact well, she doesn't connect, and she doesn't notice or care that she doesn't have friend relationships.
As hard as this is on you to watch, it doesn't seem it's making her all that unhappy.
She is different ,try getting her to meet different set of people,older,younger,active,docile,deep thinkers,how about boys?academic,athletic,curious,quiet,loud?
does she ever go to library,museum,lecture?fashion show!!
Was an early reader and as she grew up I thought she was absolutely brilliant. We would even call her "the professor" because she knew so many things and would recite them from the non fiction books she would read.
Then, around 4th grade it all changed. The grades became very inconsistent, she started freaking out over everything. She was even kicked off the cheer team because she had frequent meltdowns.
Extremely socially awkward
Can not follow instructions.
Quote:
Despite the name of this disorder, those who have Non Verbal Learning Disorder are far from nonverbal. In fact, verbal skills are their greatest asset. But because they are adept with language, verbal reasoning, and rote memory, their disabilities frequently are not detected until middle or high school. As they move up in school, comprehension often becomes challenging as they have trouble inferring, interpreting, and reading between the lines of complex assignments.
In school, kids with NLD usually have no problem memorizing facts, but they have trouble with ideas and organizing information.
Like autistic kids, kids with NLD often have trouble picking up social cues. In fact, many kids with NLD also have an autism diagnosis. Non-verbal social cues are a kind of pattern that’s hard for these kids to read.
Sometimes kids with NLD are great at the early stages of math because they’re good at memorizing. But more advanced problems get tricky because they involve noticing and applying a pattern. NLD also affects the set of skills we use to plan and organize our thinking.
Adults tend to realize something’s going on with these kids around 5th grade. That’s when school becomes less about memorizing and more about applying concepts.
Parenting a teenager always comes with its unique challenges, and it seems you’re navigating a particularly complex situation with your daughter. From your description, there’s a possibility that she might be twice-exceptional, or 2E. This term refers to individuals who are both academically gifted and neurodivergent, such as being autistic or having ADHD.
The early signs of advanced abilities you noticed in your daughter, like her precocious reading and extensive knowledge, are often characteristics of gifted children. However, when a child is both gifted and neurodivergent, their challenges can be masked by their strengths, and vice versa, making it difficult to understand their needs fully.
Your daughter’s journey, from her early brilliance to the current challenges, suggests that as social and academic demands increased, she began to struggle more. This trajectory is not uncommon in autistic individuals. The sensory issues, social difficulties, and intense focus on specific interests you’ve described align with experiences commonly shared by autistic people, especially girls and women who often remain undiagnosed or misunderstood. Autism in females can present differently than in males, leading to these traits being overlooked or misinterpreted.
Moreover, it’s worth noting that giftedness often goes hand in hand with neurodivergence. Many gifted individuals display traits that overlap with neurodivergent conditions, like heightened sensitivity and intense focus on specific areas of interest. This overlap can further complicate the understanding of your daughter’s unique profile.
Given the combination of her intellectual capabilities and her challenges in social and sensory areas, seeking a consultation with a specialist who has experience in both giftedness and neurodivergence, particularly in girls and women, could provide more clarity. A comprehensive evaluation that considers her entire developmental history and her current functioning is crucial.
Remember, understanding whether your daughter is autistic or 2E is not just about labeling her; it’s about appreciating her unique way of experiencing the world and providing the tailored support she needs. Your commitment to her well-being is clear, and with the right support and understanding, both of you can navigate these challenges more effectively.
Lastly, take care of yourself during this journey. Supporting a child with complex needs is demanding, and finding support for yourself is essential.
As sad as this looks to you, it does seem she really truly doesn't care to interact with her peers. There are girls who try desperately to be liked by peers, and are rejected, and live miserably. She doesn't seem to be experiencing that - she doesn't interact well, she doesn't connect, and she doesn't notice or care that she doesn't have friend relationships.
As hard as this is on you to watch, it doesn't seem it's making her all that unhappy.
Back when I studied abnormal psychology, this used to be known as "schizoid personality disorder" (not related to schizophrenia). Have these all fallen out of favor now that everyone's diagnosed with autism?
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