Outdated Freeway System - Minneapolis-St. Paul

[gball721]

Originally Posted by RJ8089

Having been to almost every major city in America and have lived in 10 major cities from Charlotte to L.A., I have noticed that the freeway system in MSP is downright outdated. Mainly, the many tiny freeways (2 or 3 lanes on each side) and these dangerous weaving interchanges. Are there plans for any updating and widening these freeways? Most cities are getting rid of the dangerous weaving on/off ramps. It’s crazy to see how such a great metro area is so behind on its freeway system.

Just popped in to say, as somebody who's merely visited Minneapolis/St. Paul; the "trench" (as I think of it) stretch of 494 driving west from MSP to about France Avenue seems like something out of the 1960's that needs to be overhauled and widened. But unfortunately I'm not sure how y'all would do it. There's a railroad bridge crossing there, and frontages on either side... but wow is it a bottleneck just driving it in a rental car! I think the 35 interchange just beyond that spot doesn't help either. I don't have real experience there otherwise, but wow does 494 around there need more work?!

[Rhody2Mn]

Originally Posted by gball721

Just popped in to say, as somebody who's merely visited Minneapolis/St. Paul; the "trench" (as I think of it) stretch of 494 driving west from MSP to about France Avenue seems like something out of the 1960's that needs to be overhauled and widened. But unfortunately I'm not sure how y'all would do it. There's a railroad bridge crossing there, and frontages on either side... but wow is it a bottleneck just driving it in a rental car! I think the 35 interchange just beyond that spot doesn't help either. I don't have real experience there otherwise, but wow does 494 around there need more work?!

That entire stretch of 494 between the airport and Highway 169 (where you were) is currently being revamped. It is a multi-year project with the first portion expected to end in 2026. Among other things, 494 will get HOV lanes in both directions between the 35W interchange and Highway 100, the interchange itself will receive a fly-over ramp for the northbound 35W to westbound 494 movement, and several older bridges in the corridor (specifically Nicollet, Portland, and 12th) will be widened and replaced with certain access points and exits changed or removed. The frontage roads along the corridor will also be rebuilt or removed completely.

The 494 project is much needed to bring the freeway into the modern era and I’m glad it’s finally happening. It would be nice if portions of other metro roadways were overhauled as well, but lack of funding and desire to aid vehicle drivers in any capacity (the focus will continue to be on expanding the bike and transit network) will likely keep this a pipe dream for now.

[wit-nit]

Outdated Freeway System - Minneapolis-St. Paul

Most if not all were outdated the day they were built. Planning departments are always behind times, never thinking of the long ranger future.
And look at 494/694 junction and outwards NW toward St Cloud. What a backup mess they always have.

[UMN2BE]

I love the Twin Cities but the highway system is horribly behind compared to larger metro areas and even the smaller ones I've been in. I think the two things that are still keeping the situation tolerable is (1) no population/traffic explosion like Denver, Portland, Seattle and (2) the relatively small geographic footprint of the Twin Cities - even with the crappy freeway system, it's hard to have a commute over an hour (except in bad weather) whereas in areas like NYC, LA, SF, Chicago, even Denver many would consider an hour commute to be fairly acceptable.

What worries me is how much clout some of these fringe groups have when it comes to transportation - I'm talking about the anti-car, pro-bike, whatever groups. The recent talk about shrinking I94 and converting it to a 20mph blvd with bike lanes is a perfect example of this.

Look, I lived in Hong Kong and loved public transit there, but a "robust public transit system" like that in the Twin Cities is a pipe dream. Some targeted public transit is great - the blue line being a perfect example of that. Busing is generally okay. Something like the SWLRT is a horrific example - think how many better uses that $3b+ could have been put towards.

I think people just need to accept that cars are not going anywhere. We're not going to ever get the "density" that they are dreaming about. And frankly I want my house and yard, not live in a 30 story apartment block so I could walk to the supermarket.

In a perfect world, if environmental issues are the main concern, I think focusing on biofuels, EVs, renewable energy to power them, better battery technology, more ridesharing, and (gasp) more efficient fluid roads, is ultimate a better theoretical solution.

[Rhody2Mn]

Originally Posted by UMN2BE

I love the Twin Cities but the highway system is horribly behind compared to larger metro areas and even the smaller ones I've been in. I think the two things that are still keeping the situation tolerable is (1) no population/traffic explosion like Denver, Portland, Seattle and (2) the relatively small geographic footprint of the Twin Cities - even with the crappy freeway system, it's hard to have a commute over an hour (except in bad weather) whereas in areas like NYC, LA, SF, Chicago, even Denver many would consider an hour commute to be fairly acceptable.

What worries me is how much clout some of these fringe groups have when it comes to transportation - I'm talking about the anti-car, pro-bike, whatever groups. The recent talk about shrinking I94 and converting it to a 20mph blvd with bike lanes is a perfect example of this.

Look, I lived in Hong Kong and loved public transit there, but a "robust public transit system" like that in the Twin Cities is a pipe dream. Some targeted public transit is great - the blue line being a perfect example of that. Busing is generally okay. Something like the SWLRT is a horrific example - think how many better uses that $3b+ could have been put towards.

I think people just need to accept that cars are not going anywhere. We're not going to ever get the "density" that they are dreaming about. And frankly I want my house and yard, not live in a 30 story apartment block so I could walk to the supermarket.

In a perfect world, if environmental issues are the main concern, I think focusing on biofuels, EVs, renewable energy to power them, better battery technology, more ridesharing, and (gasp) more efficient fluid roads, is ultimate a better theoretical solution.

I fully agree with everything you state here. I don’t understand why the pro-bike movement has such a powerful influence on major transportation decisions when it is still a relatively small percentage of the population.

[212david51]

The biggest problem with the Twin City freeways is too many entrances and exits close together so you constantly have people slowing down to exit crossing those speeding up to get onto the freeway.

[WoodburyWoody]

Originally Posted by 212david51

The biggest problem with the Twin City freeways is too many entrances and exits close together so you constantly have people slowing down to exit crossing those speeding up to get onto the freeway.

Short merging lanes for entry and exit too, which can make it difficult to get to speed to match the highway speed they are entering and creates a bottleneck for vehicles who sometimes have to come to a complete stop in a line of vehicles exiting.



Though, if we are honest, a LOT of drivers here would still "do the polite thing" and slow down to allow someone to merge in front of them, causing those behind them to brake. Driving habits have only gotten worse since Covid.