People are leaving Massachusetts in droves. Who are they?

[BostonBornMassMade]

Originally Posted by msRB311

I already said i dont really care what happens in the SSP parking lot. You found some pictures on days where the mall wasnt busy, what about the times that it is? This city already has very scarce parking...but whatever. I guess this is where we're at. Next it will be cemeteries?

Even if I agreed with you and said, oh yes, we need more housing, who is going to build it? There is a reason it's not being built and that reason isn't me.

Those areas are never full that how and why I knew exactly where to go and was able to respond within 2 minutes...

And they were going to build a parking garage anyway. And the existing Parking garage is also never even close to full, do I really need to show that too?

The reason stuff doesn't get built is that objectors come in and overdramatize and start talking about building on cemeteries and nature preserves like you just did. It shoots the legal feels through the rough, extends timelines, and effectively kills tons of housing units that regular working professional people would live in.

Additionally, the zoning prevents people from building economies of scale that make logical, profitable sense.

On top of that, the high COL means you have to pay high wages, which means construction is expensive. As Ive said for awhile now- its all interconnected. People think stonewalling housing is gonna be great, and maybe for some people it is..but it very clearly is the root of 90% of the issues MA is facing today.

[bostongymjunkie]

Originally Posted by BostonBornMassMade

Those areas are never full that how and why I knew exactly where to go and was able to respond within 2 minutes...

And they were going to build a parking garage anyway. And the existing Parking garage is also never even close to full, do I really need to show that too?

The reason stuff doesn't get built is that objectors come in and overdramatize and start talking about building on cemeteries and nature preserves like you just did. It shoots the legal feels through the rough, extends timelines, and effectively kills tons of housing units that regular working professional people would live in.

Additionally, the zoning prevents people from building economies of scale that make logical, profitable sense.

On top of that, the high COL means you have to pay high wages, which means construction is expensive. As Ive said for awhile now- its all interconnected. People think stonewalling housing is gonna be great, and maybe for some people it is..but it very clearly is the root of 90% of the issues MA is facing today.

And then you have people that do nothing but mock, insult, and belittle the concerns of others. They are just as much at fault. Community planning requires compromise and cooperation. In order to accomplish that people need qualities like empathy (the genuine ability to place yourself in someone else's shoes) and the ability to understand that other people's worldviews are valid. Attempting to change something by mob rule or force just demonstrates that the people don't have those qualities, are not interested in compromise and are part of the problem, not the solution. This is a common theme in government and American society. It won't be changed until individuals change themselves and stop falsely believing they have all the answers and that their view is the only legitimate view one could possibly have.

[lrfox]

Originally Posted by BostonBornMassMade

Naw, the Braintree SSP parking lot is the best example

I've been there 80 times. The parking lot is never fully used because so much of it is far from the entrance to the mall. It was supposed to have 500 apartments near a highway interchange, bus service and not too far from the line. Killed by older people who have their homes already.

That's probably 700 working people gone from the state right there. Don't worry; we have 700 migrants coming to a hotel in Braintree near you to make up for it!

I still think Weymouth is worse. Braintree is also a no brainer, but I can at least superficially understand the concerns with traffic, the removal of parking, the demand on the school system, and the visual concerns of abutters. Weymouth has the same traffic and school system concerns, but it's literally set away from any existing residential development and replacing an abandoned military base (not parking). It also is directly connected to a commuter rail station. So it's not taking away an asset (or perceived asset) and there is a commuter option onsite that can reduce the impact to local roads at peak times. Braintree has neither.

In terms of the larger housing crisis, I agree we need a whole lot more of it, and the fact that we can't even make headway on projects like SSP or Weymouth NAS which should be layups is a testament to how far behind we are. But I also think that any argument that treats the crisis like a simple issue of supply/demand is disingenuous. You can't simply build a ton of housing and have prices drop back to 2015 levels. Not only are developers working on razor thin margins (meaning they don't benefit from flooding the market with supply), but you have challenges of properties being bought as investments by non-residents (using them a short/long term rentals, foreign investment, etc.). But we do need to build more to keep the market reasonably in check.

[BostonBornMassMade]

Originally Posted by lrfox

I still think Weymouth is worse. Braintree is also a no brainer, but I can at least superficially understand the concerns with traffic, the removal of parking, the demand on the school system, and the visual concerns of abutters. Weymouth has the same traffic and school system concerns, but it's literally set away from any existing residential development and replacing an abandoned military base (not parking). It also is directly connected to a commuter rail station. So it's not taking away an asset (or perceived asset) and there is a commuter option onsite that can reduce the impact to local roads at peak times. Braintree has neither.

.

The traffic makes the least sense in Braintree. what are 500 cars on Interstate 95 and Interstate 93??

And the bus.... and Rapid transit not far away. That is precisely what makes it worse IMO. Weymouth is already far removed from the core and not nearly as desirable a location.

The time to just build more has passed. It set off a chain reaction of things that make building itself more difficult. They has had decades and didn't do it. Theres absolutely things like the infamous Black Rock and green energy requirements and interest rate hikes, and the need to recoup covid era discounts that have also put us here now.

[msRB311]

Weymouth has had a lot of new building in the past decade. So has Quincy. That's why it's irritating to hear people say that we aren't building enough. It takes time...and yes decisions on where to build are important.

There are some towns that also seem 'full'. Milton is an example...I really dont think that town has any more room, it's already a mess in terms of driving and they need another elementary school.

why is MA the only place that should be building up? What about the states around us? I've said before that MA is already currently a logistical nightmare. The MBTA is the first thing that needs to be revamped before we building more housing for people to move here.

[msRB311]

The quality of life in MA is already not so great due to traffic, bad commutes, over crowded activities/dr's offices...adding MORE people to this just doesn't seem like it will help much even if it means having an average home fall from 1.5M-1.3M - not that there's even any guarantee that will happen.

[MtPleasantDream]

Eventually more towns will become "cities", with concrete apartment buildings and busy bus lines.

You see Arlington has those 10-plus-story apartment buildings next to SFHs. Buses come every 5 minutes on Mass Ave.
Towns outside of 95 will become like that too.

[Shizim]

Originally Posted by MtPleasantDream

Eventually more towns will become "cities", with concrete apartment buildings and busy bus lines.

You see Arlington has those 10-plus-story apartment buildings next to SFHs. Buses come every 5 minutes on Mass Ave.
Towns outside of 95 will become like that too.

That sounds awful. Sign me up for no thanks. I moved to a town with no public transportation for a reason. I want low density.

[msRB311]

Originally Posted by Shizim

That sounds awful. Sign me up for no thanks. I moved to a town with no public transportation for a reason. I want low density.

apparently you're not allowed to want that...you have to make room for everyone else who wants to live here.

[newenglandgal123]

People who are leaving in droves are people who are fed up with all the overpriced houses like this $6.5M hodge podge masterpiece in Lexington! 16 Meriam St, Lexington, MA 02420 | MLS #73225735 | Zillow