Colorado to Michigan (Detroit, Warren, Ann Arbor: legal, centers, airport)

[Geo-Aggie]

Originally Posted by YAZ

Someone pleez explain that they ARE in metro Detroit.

Chelsea, Dexter, and yes, Ann Arbor = Metro Detroit
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Metro_Detroit

[MZMpac]

The Metropolitan Statistical Area is defined as 6 counties which does not include Ann Arbor. Only if you include all 9 counties in the Combined Statistical Area do you get Ann Arbor.

I dont care how the OMB defines it. I've never met someone from the Ann Arbor area who identifies as living in "Detroit", and neither will I!!

That's like saying Boulder, CO is part of the "Denver metro" area. It isnt, they are two completely separate and distinct cities almost 40 miles apart, even though they fall in the same CSA.

[Geo-Aggie]

Originally Posted by MZMpac

The Metropolitan Statistical Area is defined as 6 counties which does not include Ann Arbor. Only if you include all 9 counties in the Combined Statistical Area do you get Ann Arbor.

I dont care how the OMB defines it. I've never met someone from the Ann Arbor area who identifies as living in "Detroit", and neither will I!!

That's like saying Boulder, CO is part of the "Denver metro" area. It isnt, they are two completely separate and distinct cities almost 40 miles apart, even though they fall in the same CSA.

Meh, I'm certainly in the minority on this opinion, but based on the level of interaction between the two cities I simply don't see how one really believes it's a difference.

Ann Arbor is Detroit, Boulder is Denver, Provo is Salt Lake, San Bernadino is Los Angeles... are there major differences between these places? Yes, but when they're practically one continuous city and the commute traffic between these places is proportionally the same as the commute traffic between other nearby counties more formally considered part of the metro, I really struggle to get behind the arbitrary boundaries which seem to be drawn based on criteria that I either disagree with or don't fully understand. Okay yeah, you'll live in Ann Arbor the same as someone from Southfield lives in Southfield or someone from Sterling Heights lives in Sterling Heights, but when you're looking at things from a regional perspective you all live in Detroit. I simply don't get how Fowlerville can be "Metro Detroit" because it's in Livingston County, but Ann Arbor isn't. That's ... completely unreasonable to me, regardless of "how the OMB defines it" .

At least that's how I see it. Clearly you see it differently, and that's okay, but I still enjoy debating it

[GoBlueA2]

The unofficial line used to be I-275, but so many people have moved to Northville and Novi, that they are now included in the Metro area. Washtenaw County is definitely not. It has/had its own industry, jobs, and media. Washtenaw County doesn't have bedroom communities for Detroit jobs (although Belleville may be turning into that).

[craig11152]

Originally Posted by GoBlueA2

Washtenaw County doesn't have bedroom communities for Detroit jobs (although Belleville may be turning into that).

Belleville is actually in Wayne County.

[GoBlueA2]

Originally Posted by craig11152

Belleville is actually in Wayne County.

Whoops, I meant Rawsonville. The other "ville."

[Coldjensens]

Wane County extends west of the 275 all the way to Willow Run and includes Northville (Part), Canton, Plymouth some of ypsi.

It is hard to define a metro area. I include the following things:

Do a large number of commuters in an area work in the City?

Do people from a given area go to the city for Sports, museums, theater, dining etc.

Do businesses from the City tend to include the area as part of their local territory or do they have a operate office/yard covering that area?

Do people from the area tend to say "I am from [the big city for which the metro area is defined]" or do they say they are from the local area? It will vary from person to person, so I just try to figure out what a majority are likely to say. Obviously someone from Battle Creek would never say they are from Detroit or Detroit metro, but people from Ann Arbor do. I do not know what percentage do though.

Do metropolitan services extend to the area in question. For Example the Metropark system is a system of parks in the Detroit Metro area and extend past Ann Arbor. That points to a Yes to some extent. Does the area use the same dumps as the mtero area? Water service? Sewer? Electrical generation source?

What airport do people from the area use?

Do people from the area have their own TV stations or watch stations for the metro area? radio? do they subscribe to the metro Newspapers?

Do people from the area go to the city for government services (particularly federal government) or do they have local offices?

What is the physical distance form the area to the city and to the nearest place that is clearly part of the metropolitan area and what lies between the area and the City and/or the nearest undisputed part of the metropolitan area?

Does the telephone area code for the area also include much of the metropolitan area or the city itself?

Does the area have its own defined core?

Does the area tend to get grouped into the metropolitan area for weather reports, national news etc?

Does mail for the area come through the City postal facility or through some other hub?

Does the area have a clearly defined separate identity both locally and nationally?

is the economic well being of the area tied to the economic well being of the City?

Is the area included in any regional transportation networks?

Do people frequently move between the City or the metro area and the area in question and vice versa for shopping, dining etc?

Does the area have its own hospitals separate form the hospital system for the metro area?

Some of these items point toward Ann Arbor being part of the metro and some against. Some I do not know the answer to. As a whole, I believe a slight majority of the factors I consider point to Ann Arbor being part of Detroit Metro.

I wonder whether people in surrounding cities, say Saline, consider themselves part of the Detroit Metro? What about Ypsi?

[craig11152]

As someone who has lived in Ypsilanti and Ann Arbor since 1961 (minus 3 years in Phoenix 1971,72,73) I don't know anybody in either town who would openly call themselves part of "Metro Detroit". A lot of folks I know might use the term Southeast Michigan. And to clarify a point, none of Ypsilanti Township is in Wayne County. The county line and township line run up Rawsonville Road. The west side is Washtenaw County/Ypsi Township, the east side is Wayne County/ Van Buren Township.
As long as different cites have their own local government, police, fire, parks and recreation, tax bill, in Ann Arbors case sewer and water, they are separate entities. If you live in Royal Oak or Warren (etc) and are talking to somebody in another state referencing proximity to Detroit can clarify a location but to me that doesn't make you anything more than a neighboring municipality.

[Geo-Aggie]

What it boils down to for me is this:

Is Pontiac/Auburn Hills part of Metro Detroit?

If your answer to that is no, then I will accept that you believe Ann Arbor is not either. I won't agree with you, but I will respect your consistency of logic.
If your answer to that is yes, then you have some explaining in order to tell me why Pontiac/Auburn Hills is, but Ann Arbor is not.

Now I agree that Sterling Heights is more developed than Salem, but Ypsi/Canton/Westland vs. Bloomfield/Birmingham/Royal Oak? They're competitively developed. One is simply older and more compact, based on the urban planning norms of their age. As of 2017, Metro Detroit has expanded to the point where it includes Pontiac and Ann Arbor based on many of the criteria which Coldjensens has mentioned. Wyandotte has its own water/sewer system. It is Metro Detroit. Pretty much every town in Oakland/Macomb/Wayne have their own police/fire/school districts (6 districts in the case of Warren) they are all Metro Detroit. Whether or not someone from Ann Arbor accepts this or not isn't the point. Objectively speaking, they've fused, just as Pontiac/Auburn Hills did 40 years ago.

[craig11152]

Originally Posted by Geo-Aggie

Objectively speaking, they've fused, just as Pontiac/Auburn Hills did 40 years ago.

The only case you've made that we are "fused" is a lack of cornfields heading east.
Since more people from Wayne County come to Ann Arbor to work than the other way around I'd say Detroit is part of metro Ann Arbor.

As far as I'm concerned "Metro Detroit" is bordered by the water on the east (river and lake) I-275 on the west I-696 on the north (including the towns that straddle 696). and south to where the Detroit River ends.
Every thing else is "southeast Michigan" which I see differently than "Metro Detroit".