Possibly moving to Cheyenne for a job, anything I should know while considering it? (car, deal)
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I did nine months in Laramie (thirty miles east) for school thirty-five years ago, and have nothing but very fond memories of the state and the people. If it wasn't for the negatives of being "old in a snowy climate", I daydream about going back for the last quarter of my time on the planet. But I think southern Utah, largely for the weather alone, is going to "win" that contest. I read recently (I still peruse the "Laramie Boomerang" occasionally) that one of my favorite instructors at WyoTech (Terry Miner) passed last April - it saddens me that I was never able to re-connect with him in years past, he was a Good Guy.
As much as the Lieutenant is correct, the same could be said for all those who came after John Colter and Jim Bridger, and I'm sure the Arapaho and Cheyenne said, "There goes the neighborhood" when they first heard of Lewis and Clark going through what is now Montana. If the Lt. were to ask me for advice, it would be to remember the words of Ed Tom Bell's uncle Ellis in "No Country for old Men":
"Well, all the time ya spend trying to get back what's been took from ya, more is going out the door. After a while you just have to try to get a tourniquet on it".
I think he also said, "You can't change what's comin'".
...and when Kicking-Bird asked the 'Lew-Ten-Tent' "How many were coming ?" you remember his reply ?
"Like the STARS...."
Now it's true...for every thousand or so (per year) who travel-through to see the sights, eat some honest 'Meat an Potatoes' meals, kick-up thier heels square-dancin', spend some well-deserved time (and quiet-reflection) fly-fishing, or rockin' to & fro on a trail-ride through the wilderness...VERY few actually STAY...or make any plans to stay...
...must be all that 'vast-nothingness' (and lack of cell-service ?) between towns that scares the livin' be'jeezus out of them...
(and I am OKAY with all of that, btw)
...but there are a few who look around, see the 'back-azzwards' peeps & the social-injustices, lack of 'Gubment-Support' ("If ya can't support the Gubment, then be a Gubment-Supporter ? nah...that did'nt have quite the same comical-ring as the famous 'athletic-supporter' joke from the movie 'Grease'...lol) and they just GOTTA move right-on-in, and proceed immediately to ice-skating uphill, in a futile attempt to CHANGE things for the better...or (if nothing else) try to get things 'standardized' nationwide.
That don't seem to work to well for alot of those who DO manage to get a foot-hold here in Wyoming...
...but it sure does'nt stop'em from trying...
Like WAVES upon the shoreline, they just keep on, keeping-on...
And GOD BLESS 'em, for thier efforts...for what it's worth.
Wyoming is to liberal/progressivism, as Afghanistan is to Nations.
Anything I should know about Cheyenne, WY? Considering moving there for a job, I've driven through Wyoming, but have never lived there. Is Cheyenne a decent city?
I applied for a job there five years ago and was asked three times before the interview started if I was from there. Not sure why I didn't get the job since I'm not from there.
The city itself is pretty decent. Kind of an average mid sized city (metropolis by Wyoming standards). There are mountains not too far away if you're into outdoorsy activities and you're within 1.5 to 2 hours from Denver if you want some big city amenities. It gets cold and windy and has low humidity in the summer. Politically Wyoming is about as Republican as you can get and politics are brought up frequently.
It's a place … a wide spot in the crossroads of two major interstate highways leading to other places of much greater significance. It got established as a major railroad service center back in the day of coal/steam fired locomotives, located near a small army outpost (now a small air force base that supports ground training schools and the regional missile sites).
Several aspects of living here will stand out:
1) High altitude cold and long winters, typically bringing 5-6 months/year of snowy conditions and a fair number of serious blizzards. The more severe wintry conditions can show up as early as Oct 1st and as late as April-May. It's not unusual for multiple days of sub-zero temps to present with several days where the daily high temp doesn't reach 0 degrees F.
2) Winds! The immediate area presents one of the highest wind energy density areas of the continental USA. It's not uncommon for winter days on end to have prevailing winds in the 20-30-40 mph range with frequent gusts into the 50-60-70 mph range hammering away for hour after hour after hour, sometimes to be interrupted with gusts approaching (and sometimes exceeding!) 100 mph. This is a town where you literally watch which direction you park your car into and hang onto the door when you open it to not have it slam open or shut.
3) Shopping. While you can find almost everything you'll need here, thanks to the recent arrivals of a few box stores (WalMart, Sam's Club, Lowe's, Menard's, Home Depot), a couple Albertson's and a King Soopers … you'll find them limited compared to the offerings down the road in Fort Collins-Denver corridor. Especially for major purchases, such as an auto, you'll commonly find much better deals to be had if you'll drive a hour south of Cheyenne. Even with the expenses and time, you'll generally save a lot of money compared to the Cheyenne marketplace. It's not just consumer goods, it's farm supplies/equipment and livestock feeds/minerals.(for example, I go to Eaton or Fort Collins to buy livestock feeds in bulk, a pallet or more at a time. The savings on the identical brand/label of product can range anywhere from $2 to $4 per 50lb bag … that's at least $100 and as much as $200 savings per ton for my effort. While I'd prefer to do business with my local merchant, I can't justify the substantially higher price they charge in Cheyenne given that the price in Colorado represents a hefty profit margin in a much more expensive locale to do business than Cheyenne. Similarly, we oft-times see less expensive gasoline or diesel fuel at the pump in Ft Collins than in Cheyenne while Colorado has higher per gallon fuel taxes and environmental costs to the stations … figure that one out, especially since much of the refined fuels in northern Colorado come from the refinery here in Cheyenne).
4) Medical. In a word, the local medical services suck. I was lucky to find one competent dentist here who wasn't a "More BUCKS!" practice. The last "more bucks" dentist I used sold me on a totally unneeded crown and did such a horrible job of it that he created a pulpitis in the tooth he worked as well as the adjacent tooth. His premise for the work was that I was grinding my teeth and was in immediate danger of losing that molar; I'd never had another dentist diagnose such a problem nor have I had a dentist since suggest that I had a tooth grinding problem. The other molar that the bad dentist here frantically claimed I'd lose if it wasn't crowned ASAP has held up without any issues for 10 years since his botched work in my jaw.
Similarly, I've needed internal work after a colonoscopy showed polyps … and the surgeon who did the polypectomy did a poor job, leaving a lot of one polyp at it's margins. That required multiple follow-up visits with his associate as an outpatient, and he wasn't able to complete the work properly, either. He told me that I was at an extreme risk of needing to go on a colostomy bag because there wasn't enough intestine left after his work to do a clean job of it. It was only upon his departure from the group practice here in Cheyenne that he referred me to another practice in Denver that had the expertise and equipment to do the work properly in one visit, verified by follow-up colonoscopy's. In all candor, the medical care here for this problem was borderline medical malpractice … after the surgery and two failed follow-up attempts to correct the first botched job, the doc knew that he had neither the talent or equipment to do the job properly but persisted in more attempts while knowing that his contact in Denver had the skills and equipment to do the job. Again, it was only because he was leaving the Cheyenne practice that he advised me that the Cheyenne group didn't have the equipment to do the job properly and referred me to his Denver connection. Such is the situation of medical ethics here in Cheyenne; if you need elective surgery/medical attention, you'll do far better to get services in the Colorado front range medical community. (I've also needed cardiac work, and the clinic here in Cheyenne has been nothing but a revolving door of specialists. In the space of 10 years, I had 1 good doc there who stayed on for 6 months, another stayed around for 2 years. The final straw for me was the last doc who did my work-up for the FAA (I'm a pilot) after my annual stress echo which had consistent good results with my prior years' of stress echo's. But rather than simply submit the good results of the test, he volunteered that I should have additional testing (MORE $$$$'s) to support the good test. I was mortified, since I knew that the FAA doc's in KC would react that if my doc saw a need for more tests, that they would, too, require far more stringent evaluation of my cardiac abilities and functioning. I asked the doc why he'd volunteer such a requirement, and his response was that given my underlying cardiac condition, the FAA "would likely ask for more supporting tests, so he was just getting a head start on doing them". Idiot, all of those other concerns had been addressed and resolved with the FAA in previous years … at significant medical and legal expense to preserve my medical certificate to the satisfaction of the FAA. Again, the ethics here in Cheyenne of the group practice was to blantantly promote MORE INCOME than to serve the needs of the patient, especially in view of the fact that the Cheyenne cardiologist didn't communicate to me that his professional opinion was that I needed more testing to confirm my good condition. He was simply leveraging my condition against the FAA med cert department to sell more (unneeded) cardio testing and doctor fees against my best interests and health. To minimize my hassles and likely expenses … if not loss of my flight medical … I selected another cardiologist in Fort Collins who reviewed my current stress echo and gave me a favorable report to submit to the FAA which was accepted. I've been with that cardiologist for 12 years and we've had no glitches with the FAA since.
Another example of crappy medical services here in Cheyenne: While working on a piece of equipment at the farm, I sliced the web between a thumb and forefinger open. It wasn't bleeding, but obviously needed care and stitches. I went to an outpatient "emergency" medical facility here, one with lots of billboard advert's in town. After an hour delay, they finally had a NP look at my hand. She agreed it needed cleaning and stitches, but they couldn't do it at the time. So I was discharged and left to my own devices to find another medical provider. I went to another "emergency room" facility, where I was seen by another NP who cleaned the wound and a doc who put in the needed 8 stitches. I gave both places my med insurer info. Subsequently, the first facility submitted a bill for their "services" which used up almost all of the allowed benefit from my insurance policy. That left me with having to pay, at full retail … not the "in-network" discount adjusted rate … the fees from the second facility which actually provided the medical care. If it hadn't been for needing the anesthesia for the stitches, my wife … who has done her fair share of stitches on our livestock … would have done as good a job cleaning out the wound and stitching me up with her vet supplies. It cost me over $500 for those 8 stitches and I couldn't justify going back to town to have them removed when it was time to do so; my wife had them out in a minute.
5) Restaurants. There's about 3, maybe 4, restaurants in Cheyenne worthy of your trade. Otherwise, they're all pretty crappy to marginal, at best. That leaves the usual assortment of fast food, franchise burger joints, pizza chains and similar junk food outfits … if you like these types of places, you'll be OK. I don't, so the dearth of decent restaurants in Cheyenne is remarkable. We head down to Fort Collins for most of our dining out meals … and there you'll find one of the highest per capita restaurant marketplaces in the USA. With some remarkably good places of all calibers, from "cheap eats" through fairly fine dining experiences, and multiples to choose from in each category, including ethnic restaurants of many sources. Alternatively, there are a number of restaurants around Wyoming worth heading to … in Laramie, Saratoga, Hudson, Casper, and so forth, one-offs that have worked hard to establish a good reputation and keep it. Considering that there's a lot of towns in Wyoming that depend upon the tourist trade, it's surprising how bad most of the food/hospitality is around this state … unless you're a fan of the pre-pack institutional food from the big restaurant suppliers (Sysco, for example).
As a manufacturer's rep traveling this region for years, I've had the opportunity to visit many restaurants around Wyoming. Let me put the experience in perspective … I was in Riverton, calling upon a client. When I invited them to lunch, a pretty standard perk of a sales call, they declined my offer. They said that "there wasn't anyplace in town that they'd want to go out for lunch" and they preferred the lunch that their family would be bringing over in awhile. I had a similar result in Jackson, Cody, Dubois, Lander, and Evanston, among other towns.
6) Housing costs. With the changes of Colorado's economic, political, and social scene, Cheyenne has become even more of a bedroom community area to Colorado's front range. This has markedly driven up the cost of housing in Cheyenne, especially the newer housing projects. Previously, it was reasonable to seek out acreage (equine) properties with a decent house … now it's a seller's market and prices have skyrocketed. Savvy buyers bought up a lot of the rental properties in the area a few years ago and have priced that segment up to where even marginal properties are competing with the single family homes of yesteryear at premium prices. It's no longer the bargain marketplace that presented years ago where the choice to commute was less expensive than staying in Colorado for work.
7) Be forewarned that the weather here will be a significant factor in choosing your outdoor activities for much of the year.
8) Paid Entertainment is pretty limited here. If you're used to lots of choices for movie screens, first-run flicks, theater, concerts, "happening" places, pro sports events (there's no major league teams in the state) … you will likely be disappointed in Cheyenne. "big league" events generally mean travel to Denver or other out of state venues. There's only one University in the state … UW, in Laramie … and college level sports are a big deal there. Otherwise, the big event in Cheyenne is Frontier Days, with it's days of rodeo events and evening performances of various county and pop stars.
9) Social and support systems are limited compared to many other states and metropolitan areas. They're not funded or supported as you'd expect in other states or metro areas. Cheyenne has fairly limited resources and services with the outlying areas having almost none.
10) There's effectively no public transportation here. The airport has a long history of not being able to support airline services, even with federal subsidy monies for essential air services. IIRC, there's now only a few scheduled flights per week to Dallas or a similar hub airport. You'll be driving (or taking the shuttle service) to DIA for most air travel. Cab and bus service in Cheyenne is rather limited.
OTOH …
1) If you're an outdoorsman, hunter or fisherman, many of the opportunities here rival the best of the continental USA.
2) Low population density and a lot of public lands means plenty of places to go where you'll not be seeing crowds competing for the solitude and access for your outdoor recreation. Of course, this means seeking out those places that aren't at the top of the tourist lists, especially for weekends or major holidays. I've had many a day in the local Cheyenne/Laramie county parks all to myself for equine riding, fishing, or simply a modest hike & lunch in the wilderness. Regionally, during the mid-week (in my RV traveling salesman days) I've had numerous camping nights at a lake almost all to myself all around the state … or with so few other folk there as to essentially be alone.
3) If you enjoy being somewhat self-reliant and having most of the freedom and room to do so, Cheyenne may be your "cup 'o tea". Especially so if you settle in one of the outlying areas on a bit of acreage. Perhaps, if you're into horses, you'll find lots of opportunities for equine properties, along with places that allow livestock … if that's your interest.
The bottom line is that Cheyenne … along with most of Wyoming … presents a unique set of opportunities and challenges. Many folk have found that what's here is not what they are expecting or comfortable dealing with … hence the "gone in two" syndrome which I've seen so often around here. Folk move here with a paradigm somewhat based upon a disneyized version of Yellowstone and discover that living here is an entirely different proposition. I've seen folk from MI, given great job opportunities from WYDOT in view of no jobs "back home" … pack up and leave within two years to no job but better living conditions "back home". I've seen folk from WI move back there because the winters were easier to deal with than living here in Cheyenne. And I've seen folk from many riparian states move here and leave quickly when the realities of living in a high altitude desert of Wyoming are not what they'd like to deal with. There's simply so many changes here from what most folk live with around the USA that adjustment isn't feasible for them.
For the most part, I've seen only a very small percentage of the folk that have moved here over the last few decades adjust to and be happy/satisfied with what living here is all about. For some, it's the climate. For others, it's the social isolation. For some, it's the distances and time to access the things that they realize are important details in life to them … many details of which they don't recognize until they don't have the ready access they took for granted in their other homes (small things, like being able to dine out late in the eve, or have take-out or delivery on demand).
So … here's my advice, OP: make a few trips out here, summer and winter, and look at Cheyenne with a view of actually living here. Check out the housing, food, utilities, recreational, services, dining, entertainment, social, transportation costs for your needs in comparison to your projected earnings. Do this before making any decision about moving to Cheyenne. As well, take a while to observe the social and political scene here. For the most part, Cheyenne is pretty conservative area. Some things are taken for granted here (and protected, too) … such as firearms ownership … open carry is legal, WY concealed carry without a permit is legal (although a permit can be obtained for the reciprocity with other states). If you're not comfortable being around an armed populace, Cheyenne isn't the place for you … even though the armed society here is quite law-abiding. GLW your potential relocation.
PS: other than a quick visit for business/sales calls, my time in Austin is very limited. I was under the impression that it's quite a "liberal" city socially and politically. It would be an understatement to suggest that Cheyenne is the extreme opposite of Austin in this aspect. If this is a priority for you, may I humbly suggest that a move to Cheyenne would not be a good move for you.
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
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No In&out Burger, but home of Taco John's.
Your favorite hobbies and activities? These may need to change.
There is not much happening in Cheyenne, much more in Laramie (university).
Ft Collins, CO (college town) is 1 hr away if you need a dose of "Trendy and Spendy". Or for that monthly run to Costco.
Greeley is also a college town and 1 hr away.
Fishing and hunting is ~1hr away (or more).
So.... Compared to Bay Area... Less traffic, less people...but similar distances to outdoor recreation. But... Nearly 2 hrs to Denver airport and events. (Driving in good weather).
Snow, blizzards happen.
Laramie is ~45 min - one hr West! Weather permitting.
First thing here, THANK YOU TO ALL WHOM HAVE POSTED LOTS OF GREAT INSIGHT. MANY thanks. Seriously.
My Honey's son is taking a job in Cheyenne very soon and needs to get settled as quickly as possible. What moving company would you suggest from western CO to Cheyenne?
I know it's only 6hrs between. Not much of a move at all. Nonetheless, would it be better to have a moving company from western CO or Cheyenne do it? That is, if there is one in Cheyenne of course.
We're looking to NOT move him entirely ourselves...again. Even though it is only a one bdrm place he has, and will likely move into up there. Yes, it could all fit in our 4-horse gn trailer. What are some thoughts here?
Location: We_tside PNW (Columbia Gorge) / CO / SA TX / Thailand
34,914 posts, read 58,682,242 times
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Measure it up and send it out for quotes. His Western CO location could be on I-70, or far from there, so... we are only guessing.
An empty backhaul using Uship or similar would likely be least expensive for small / partial load One Way.
For a company to run RT with vehicle and labor (2) minimium will not be inexpensive. I would guess your best prices will be local (Contracting from Western CO to Cheyenne RT return). Front Range and Cheyenne local places may not have the authority for interstate goods. And fearful of their safety (liability) sending FR truck and crew to Western Slope.
I think you already know where this is leading "AGAIN",,,...
Quote:
We're looking to NOT move him entirely ourselves...again.
options... serious downsizing and send him off via Greyhound... "See Ya"
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Moving advice, thoughts, 'n input...
