Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
It's been said that the lockdown has shown that a lot of desk jobs can be done remotely and therefore in the near future they will go down the route of manufacturing jobs and get exported to so called cheap labour countries.
It's also been said that even some skilled jobs might suffer the same fate. Example: why bother hiring an expensive architect here in the UK/any developed country when you can hire one remotely in somewhere like India or Malaysia?
Do you think this is true? How likely is it that it will happen?
I would be really concerned if I was a white collar employee working from Home unless they are in a very niches, specialized field.
Do people not realize what this country has been doing since Clinton signed the NAFTA deals?
Companies may be saving a bit more money with the remote stuff, but they can save even MORE money outsourcing the jobs entirely. And if they can they will.
Exported where? TO a sweat shop in China or Mexico. The desk jobs that haven't been exported yet are jobs that require unique skills, education, communication skills, and experience. Its not cheap simple manual labor or call centers that anyone can do, or they would already be exported. Maybe you could find some cheap architects and engineers in other countries to save maybe $30,000 in salary, and then see your building fall down or cost millions from mistakes.
Architects also spend a lot of time on jobs sites and onsite meetings and are involved daily throught the whole construction process. YOu can't do that from another country or if you can't speak english. There would also be issues with being in opposite timezones. You can't be calling and sending emails at 10:00 AM everyday to another country where its 2:00 am there. There is also a lot of liabilty in construction, so you can't handle legal or financial issues with contries with different or poor legal systems. This is just an example, but this would apply to many other white collared professions.
Exported where? TO a sweat shop in China or Mexico. The desk jobs that haven't been exported yet are jobs that require unique skills, education, communication skills, and experience. Its not cheap simple manual labor ro call centers that anyone can do. You could find some cheap architects and engineers in other countries to save maybe $30,000 in salary, and then see your building fall down or cost millions from mistakes. Architects also spend a lot of time on jobs sites and onsite meetings. YOu can't do that from another country or if you can't speak english. There would also be issues with being in opposite timezones. You can't be calling and sending emails at 2:00 AM everyday to another country where its 10:00 am there. There is also a lot of liabilty in construction, so you can't handle legal or financial issues with contries with different or poor legal systems.
There are plenty of highly capable professionals in developing countries....and it wouldn't be hard to separate legitimate ones and their companies from hacks who attended diploma mills or something (especially, but not only, because a lot of the good ones attended university in western world to begin with). And [eye roll] there's certainly no lack of professionals who speak English in developing countries....especially in former colonies.......
I guess architects were not the best examples but there are other skilled jobs that could certainly get exported.
As for the time zone issue...I guess europeans could hire people in Souh Africa and Americans people in Southern Cone of Souh America.
I would be really concerned if I was a white collar employee working from Home unless they are in a very niches, specialized field.
Do people not realize what this country has been doing since Clinton signed the NAFTA deals?
Companies may be saving a bit more money with the remote stuff, but they can save even MORE money outsourcing the jobs entirely. And if they can they will.
Um so what is the difference between remote hiring and 'outsourcing them entirely'?
There are plenty of highly capable professionals in developing countries....and it wouldn't be hard to separate legitimate ones and their companies from hacks who attended diploma mills or something (especially, but not only, because a lot of the good ones attended university in western world to begin with). And [eye roll] there's certainly no lack of professionals who speak English in developing countries....especially in former colonies.......
I guess architects were not the best examples but there are other skilled jobs that could certainly get exported.
As for the time zone issue...I guess europeans could hire people in Souh Africa and Americans people in Southern Cone of Souh America.
Well obviously something is wrong with your reasoning because these jobs are not going to other "cheaper" countries, so are you saying you know better than the executives and owners of these companies, or is it more likely you don't understand what you are talking about? The professionals in other contries probably have plenty of opportunities in their home countries and still command a high salary. You still can't attend weekly in-person meetings from halfway around the world. There are many issues. Short answer is any cost savings from pay are made up with other expenses and issues.
THe reality is that the opposite is what happens. The US is home of many global corporations that serve the world, and these companies pay high salaries to have access to all this talent. Their cheap labor is outsourced, but their corporate jobs are in large US cities. Look at any major tech company as an example. Apple is in the most expensive city the the country, but their products are assembled overseas with cheap labor. If both are overseas, its no longer an American company.
Well obviously something is wrong with your reasoning because these jobs are not going to other "cheaper" countries, so are you saying you know better than the executives and owners of these companies, or is it more likely you don't understand what you are talking about? The professionals in other contries probably have plenty of opportunities in their home countries and still command a high salary. You still can't attend weekly in-person meetings from halfway around the world. There are many issues. Short answer is any cost savings from pay are made up with other expenses and issues.
Firs of all, what's your problem? Did you wake up on the wrong side of the bed? Mind your tone and the words you choose...
Employers used to be unsure whether exporting desk jobs and highly skilled ones was doable and a beneficial thing but now the lockdown has, allegedly, shown that it's possible. I didn't claim that this was FACT or even that I tended to agree that it was true. I was just asking people's opinion about this recently emerged idea and inviting them to discuss (focus and read my first post again). So there's no need to address my own personal reasoning (there wasn't one) and accusing me of not knowing what I'm talking about.
And no, most professionals in developing countries don't have as many opportunities and salaries as high as those in developed countries. I know this because I'm originally from a middle income country.
Location: East of Seattle since 1992, 615' Elevation, Zone 8b - originally from SF Bay Area
44,709 posts, read 81,563,799 times
Reputation: 58028
The less skilled desk jobs have been outsourced to other countries for many years now. Have you ever called for support or done an online "help session" with a cable company, phone company, or software company, and you could hardly understand them? Despite the pandemic and working from home the major tech employers are still hiring skilled workers from other countries and bringing them here. Just in the last year two homes in our neighborhood were sold to Indian families, both men work at Amazon. At the local elementary school where my wife teaches ESL there are students whose first language is
Hindi, Mandarin, Cantonese, German, and Portuguese.
It's also been said that even some skilled jobs might suffer the same fate. Example: why bother hiring an expensive architect here in the UK/any developed country when you can hire one remotely in somewhere like India or Malaysia?
Do you think this is true? How likely is it that it will happen?
This has been happening for a long time already. Not just call center jobs or menial stuff. Software, circuit design, etc. Over the past 15-20 years I've worked with many people from India, Singapore, and a couple of Eastern European countries. Salaries are much lower, especially for people just out of college. Retention tends to be a problem, though.
Some companies are more aggressive than others with respect to offshoring this sort of work. I'm sure if it were easy, most would send almost all of the jobs overseas. In the real world it usually takes a long time (many years, and even decades) to assemble the talent and the ecosystems to make complex systems that are reliable and marketable.
This has been happening for a long time already. Not just call center jobs or menial stuff. Software, circuit design, etc. Over the past 15-20 years I've worked with many people from India, Singapore, and a couple of Eastern European countries. Salaries are much lower, especially for people just out of college. Retention tends to be a problem, though.
Some companies are more aggressive than others with respect to offshoring this sort of work. I'm sure if it were easy, most would send almost all of the jobs overseas. In the real world it usually takes a long time (many years, and even decades) to assemble the talent and the ecosystems to make complex systems that are reliable and marketable.
Why is retention a problem?
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
