Some things don't change... (Pittsburgh, Allentown: how much, unemployment, neighborhood)

[Drover]

I expect I'll get some flak from the cheerleaders, but here goes anyway...

I just heard the song "Allentown" by Billy Joel. The song was released in 1982. And it's depressing how much of it rings true today. And not specifically in Allentown either; despite that city being the setting, the song was really an allegory for the entire industrial rust belt. The song could just have easily been set in the Allentown neighborhood of Pittsburgh.

"Well we're waiting here in Allentown, for a Pennsylvania we never found; for the promises our teachers gave, if we worked hard, if we behaved...

"And we're waiting here in Allentown, but they've taken all the coal from the ground; and the union people crawled away......."

Meanwhile, 25 years later and despite the best efforts of many, too many others are still waiting around for the return of the Pennsylvania that was promised to them by their forbears who took for granted that the manufacturing economy would be around forever. Too many refuse to come to grips that those days are never coming back; or in the alternative, they just don't know what to do about it and are waiting for divine directions on what to do next.

Sometimes I think Pittsburgh's salvation will finally come only when the Rust Belt cities are the only places left where people can afford to buy a house...

[tommygoat]

Two words on the horizon: liquid coal. The waiting may be over?

[MaryS80]

There are areas that are still depressed, and they may never recover. I was just in the Midland/Ohioville area, and its one of those places that will never return to what it was. Other areas around Pittsburgh have started to floursih in the last 10 years or so. The area around Robinsin and North Fayette is a great example.

America as a whole has changed from a nation of people who worked in factories, mills, and manufacturing, to cushy office jobs and the like. After the mills closed many people left the area. Many people leave when the retire to escape the weather. Pennsylvania has either the highest or second highest numer of elderly citizens, which often puts the mortality rate higher then the birth rate.

There has to be some sort of incentive for people and companies to relocate there.

[Katarina Witt]

Originally Posted by tommygoat

Two words on the horizon: liquid coal. The waiting may be over?

Are you talking about oil shale? It has been both a boom and a bust for Colorado. Boom in the early 80s, bust for the next 25 yrs, now boom again. Don't be the farm on it!

[JoeP]

Places like Midland and the Mon Valley can only do so much, but the city and burbs not industrial. It's history and frankly it's useless to bring it up unless you want to have detailed discussion about the region's transformation.

[Hopes]

Allentown in Pittsburgh was depressed way before the collapse of the steel industry.

[Drover]

Originally Posted by MaryS80

There has to be some sort of incentive for people and companies to relocate there.

Non-insane taxes would be a start.

Originally Posted by Hopes

Allentown in Pittsburgh was depressed way before the collapse of the steel industry.

Like I said, the specific location is irrelevent; the song is an allegory for any city in the rust belt. It could have just as easily been set in Buffalo, Weirton, Youngstown, Cleveland, Detroit, Gary, Scranton, Toledo, or Pittsburgh.

[Hopes]

Originally Posted by Drover

Like I said, the specific location is irrelevent; the song is an allegory for any city in the rust belt. It could have just as easily been set in Buffalo, Weirton, Youngstown, Cleveland, Detroit, Gary, Scranton, Toledo, or Pittsburgh.

But Pittsburgh isn't depressed anymore---not like that.

Come on. Think about it.

After the crash of the steel industry:

everyone owned old beat up cars. They did their own maintenance work---even their own bodywork and paint jobs. Look around now. For the most part, Pittsburghers are driving the latest car models. And they're not doing their own bodywork and painting them with spray cans---that's for sure.

The unemployment office was packed every single day. The line went outside and down the block. You could be sure to spend the day at the unemployment office. And you'd see so many people you knew while waiting in line. Today, there's a handful of people in line.

Call me a Pittsburgh cheerleader if you like, but there's nothing cheery about setting the facts straight. It's completely inaccurate when people claim that Pittsburgh is still depressed after the collapse of the steel industry. You'd have to have lived here during the depression and still live here today to see there is a huge difference.

A large booming population and economy eventually brings instability to a region. Huge population growth brings a higher cost of living and more stress on the infrastructure. There's not a darn thing wrong with a steady economy. Housing prices around the country have topped off in many places. Pittsburgh housing prices remain on a steady insteace because Pittsburgh doesn't have bubbles.

Billy Joel's song might have been representative of Pittsburgh at one time. But it's not anymore.

[Hopes]

Originally Posted by pittnurse70

Are you talking about oil shale? It has been both a boom and a bust for Colorado. Boom in the early 80s, bust for the next 25 yrs, now boom again. Don't be the farm on it!

You have to understand the industry to realize why that happens, PittNurse. Many Colorado companies were bought by Pennsylvania companies over the past 20 years. The oil doesn't go anywhere during the booms and busts. It's still there. Oil and gas companies switch from drilling, exploration, and acquisitions depending on which way the economy swings. And you can bet your money on it. Done right, it's a good long term investment. Buy stock during a bust because you'll make money selling during a boom. And if you like to take risks become an investor in an oil well or field. Of course, that's only for those who can afford to take the risk.

[Katarina Witt]

The shale production ceased. A lot of people lost jobs, money, etc, Hopes. The developers of the oil shale towns tried to turn them into retirement communities with only a little success. I repeat, a lot of money was lost. I would not hold out hope that oil shale will 'revitalize' the Pennsylvania ecomony long term. Maybe not even very short term. It was all over in a few years in Colorado, to lie dormant for 25 yrs.