Observations from an outsider. LONG READ! (Scranton, Wilkes-Barre: section 8, for sale, real estate)

[DowntownJerseyCity]

Ok first off, I want no harsh words from SWB...hey man, the King's family has to stay together!

My old college buddies and I spent a VERY long weekend at the Woodlands in Wilkes-Barre (last Friday to today), for the long Memorial Day weekend reunion which has become a tradition with us since we all left our beloved King's College.

We all sat down to dinner tonight before everyone headed back to Philly, Jersey, Boston, and Long Island, and we all had the same opinions about what direction "the Valley" was heading in.

I have to tell you, the surrounding towns (Edwardsville, Larksville, Plymouth, etc...) are in a terrible state of borderline disrepair, and parts of Wilkes-Barre are starting to resemble Newark and Irvington which is very disturbing.

What made it get this way? Affordable housing is what did it and here is why...

The "undesirable" crowd from NYC, Jersey, and Philly saw a great opportunity to still ride on the welfare wagon getting their big city welfare checks, and spending much less by moving to NEPA and setting up their drug and weapons business.

The aging population has nobody to give their houses to (the kids moved elsewhere for good paying white collar jobs), and an investor comes in and section 8's the whole thing, thus bringing in all the garbage.

From what we saw, there are a few towns which are holding on (Wyoming, Forty Fort, West Pittston, Old Forge, and parts of Kingston) to a good community, but those other towns are like a cancer, and sadly, I feel that soon enough it will spread to the better towns.

There are ways to turn this negative into a positive. First off, the "not in my backyard" mentality has to stop in the area. These blowhard hacks that call themselves politicians all need to be voted out. Stop giving the farm away, stop discouraging business growth, and while you're at it, start limiting the number of section 8 housing that can be allocated. These "newcomers" are not looking for a weekend retreat, trust me.

Secondly, if people are complaining because none of the college grads are sticking around, then do something about it! Offer HUGE tax incentives to companies looking to flee overpriced and overtaxed NYC and North Jersey. What some people don't understand is that even though the companies are not being heavily taxed, all the newcomers buying houses and paying income taxes will make up for it. The revenue stream will be coming from somewhere. Montage and Scranton have the right idea to a degree.

Lastly, and SWB is going to kill me for this one, but start developing, even if it means demolishing old, and replacing with new! Old houses are great to look at, but for the most part are a maintenance nightmare, and most homeowners don't want to deal with the upkeep.

I really don't think the sprawl killed those little downtown's. I honestly believe that as the store owners retired and died off, there was nobody there to take over. The kids left for greener pastures years earlier and that was it. It was the perfect opportunity for the big-box chains to come in and dominate a market.

To end this little rant, I have to say that all of us wanted to stay in the area after graduation, but no jobs = no money = no future.

Would we all come back there to work, live, and raise our families? You're damn right we would, but if nothing changes there won't be too many people returning to that area.

My best friend said it best tonight. He said "give me a job that pays 75K today in the Valley, and I am pounding the for sale sign in the front yard of my Philly house tomorrow".

I don't think the community leaders understand how bad a good deal of us "non-natives" wanted to stay in the area.

[Suzer]

I'm new to the area, and can't yet contribute significantly to the conversation, but here's my experience -

I applied for a professional position with a SWB area college. It required a Master's degree and several years of experience.

I was called for an interview, and was very pleased. Before scheduling a time, the woman prefaced the appointment by saying, "this position pays $11.00 an hour". I didn't know how to respond - I was so caught off guard that I told her I had to think about it.

If this what the market will bear, I'll live in NEPA and ply my trade in NY or NJ. One more observation - Look at the difference between Milford, PA, and Port Jervis, NY. One critical difference is the abundance of Section 8 housing in Port Jervis. Similar situation in Newburgh, NY. Both have the potential to be a nice blend of modern amenities and gorgeous vintage homes on the water.

[debolina]

excellant post! I also think that some homeowners who were recently able to take advantage of the real estate mkt sold homes in these areas to some of the people coming in from the big cities and investors, only to not realize how many of them would later become section 8 homes which continues the vicious circle. Sure they had home sales but at what cost? It is a shame. I like your idea of limiting the number of section 8 homes.

[NYRangers 2008]

It sounds to me like HobokenGuy was originally from this area and then came back to visit only to find out things have gotten worse not better. He makes some valid points. He's right about people in this area having the "not in my backyard" mentality. This has to stop or this area will never move forward. It sounds like he would come back, but there is nothing enticing him to.

[DowntownJerseyCity]

Originally Posted by mannny

Thanks for your "expert" opinion Hobokenguy.Now please leave and go analyze Hoboken.

You revive an old thread, and that's all you have to say?

Your posts are well thought out and very informative.

https://www.city-data.com/forum/north...ml#post1304631

[DowntownJerseyCity]

Originally Posted by NYRangers 2008

It sounds to me like HobokenGuy was originally from this area and then came back to visit only to find out things have gotten worse not better. He makes some valid points. He's right about people in this area having the "not in my backyard" mentality. This has to stop or this area will never move forward. It sounds like he would come back, but there is nothing enticing him to.

Nope, not originally from the area, but I visited the area alot in the summers when I was a young boy (have an aunt and uncle in Wyoming and cousins in West Pittston), then decided to go to college there. You're correct in saying that I'd come back. I really would do it in a second if the jobs were plentiful and the pay was a notch or two higher.

I truly do miss NEPA and make it a point to still go out there to visit my one friend who did find a job in Dumnore. There are great, hard-working people in that area who woild give you the shirt off their backs if you needed it. In my eyes, that's what makes the area so great...well...that and the Old Forge pizza that seems like I am one of the few who actually appreciates a very unique pie.

[lookin'for"home"]

right on Hoboken guy.

[NYRangers 2008]

Originally Posted by HobokenGuy

Nope, not originally from the area, but I visited the area alot in the summers when I was a young boy (have an aunt and uncle in Wyoming and cousins in West Pittston), then decided to go to college there. You're correct in saying that I'd come back. I really would do it in a second if the jobs were plentiful and the pay was a notch or two higher.

You're right there. The jobs in this area are not that good and don't pay much. Look at what Suzer said in her post. She has a degree and experience and they only offered her $11 an hour. Not good enough compared to NY or NJ.

[Summering]

Originally Posted by NYRangers 2008

You're right there. The jobs in this area are not that good and don't pay much. Look at what Suzer said in her post. She has a degree and experience and they only offered her $11 an hour. Not good enough compared to NY or NJ.

I have seen where a Medical Assistant, or an LPN ,has gone into a doctors office for an interview and laughed at what they offered as a salary.
Some having good experience ,and great schooling.
Things are a bit better then 10 years ago. But, by far not enough.........
A single mother could never make ends meet in Pa.
I've sadly known a few...........

[exscrantonian]

I recall Stephen King describing a town in Maine as saying goodbye to each high school graduate once he or she had that diploma in hand. Brain drain is a problem in ME as it is in NEPA. Problem is that larger urban areas typically pay better and there are plentiful jobs and opportunities.

I left NEPA to go to school 20 years ago and there was a time that I would have jumped at the chance to go back but there were no jobs in my field and I had teacher friends on the hiring list for local districts like Scranton for years. They finally gave up and found jobs in the Delaware Valley schools.

Pay needs to be increased and there needs to be incentives for people to return like tax breaks and that sort of thing. Here in Maine we have a program called jobs for Maine graduates.