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Having been advised that it is best to hire an independent Structural Engineer prior to gathering any foundation work bids, I did just that. Turns out, Engineer No. 1, misrepresented himself as being a licensed, Structural Engineer. He is a licensed Civil Engineer who advised me that my foundation had failed. He estimated repair cost at $65K (to "do it right"). Might as well quoted me $500K - no way. He also suggested I file suit on the homebuilder for "defective construction." Home is out of Warranty - Attorneys advised the Statute of Limitations would be an uphill battle to fight, especially given Texas' lienent laws for homebuilder's quality of workmanship. Forensic testing $2500-$3K; attorney $7500 + 25% of any settlement and no guarantees.
Ok, Structural Engineer number two comes in (second opinion), takes measurements, same as number one. Cashes check, and I've yet to receive a written report advising me how to proceed.
Both Engineers said that the concrete piers, helical piers and steel piers touted by the various foundation repair companies are all bound to fail.
So, does anyone in the SA area have any advice on how to proceed? Who can you trust? The Independent Engineers can't be trusted, and I've spent $800 already and have no way to be able to verify who is telling me the truth regarding what needs to be done and what type of repair will actually work. The foundation companies' websites explain why their competitor's products will fail. Who is telling the truth? Has anyone had their SA foundation repaired by Concrete peirs? If so, how long ago, and have you had to place a Warranty call? Same question regarding steel piers.
Any help/advise would be greatly appreicated. Thanks!
We had 28-32 (can't remember the exact number) of piers put in almost 2 years ago by Perma Pier. I feel they did a decent job. Foundation trouble is not fun nor is it cheap. We had a slab leak under our garage.
This is one of those "I wish I had known you were looking for an engineer". You don't need a civil or a professional engineer, you need a forensic engineer. The best one in the the USA for this area is Homer Parker out of Round Rock. I've worked with Homer on a lot of homes in regards to failing foundations. But I assume you've already spent a lot and don't want to spend more. It can be frustrating dealing with these guys as most , frankly, don't have a clue about what they are doing....and some of them come with a big name.
In regards to the builder warranty, in Texas, if the house was built after 2003, any builder defect is warranted in perpetuity. But you are in the position to prove it was a defect. That's what a credible engineer can bring to the table, like Homer Parker.
What area of town or subdivision do you live in? When you purchased the house, did you receive documentation in regards to the Plasticity Index of the soil for you particular lot? It's been a required document for new home sales for several decades. You might go to the library at SAC and look into the soil reports by the Army Corps and see what the PI is versus the design of the slab- if it's not enough, there's your builder defect.
Having been advised that it is best to hire an independent Structural Engineer prior to gathering any foundation work bids, I did just that. Turns out, Engineer No. 1, misrepresented himself as being a licensed, Structural Engineer. He is a licensed Civil Engineer who advised me that my foundation had failed. He estimated repair cost at $65K (to "do it right"). Might as well quoted me $500K - no way. He also suggested I file suit on the homebuilder for "defective construction." Home is out of Warranty - Attorneys advised the Statute of Limitations would be an uphill battle to fight, especially given Texas' lienent laws for homebuilder's quality of workmanship. Forensic testing $2500-$3K; attorney $7500 + 25% of any settlement and no guarantees.
Ok, Structural Engineer number two comes in (second opinion), takes measurements, same as number one. Cashes check, and I've yet to receive a written report advising me how to proceed.
Both Engineers said that the concrete piers, helical piers and steel piers touted by the various foundation repair companies are all bound to fail.
So, does anyone in the SA area have any advice on how to proceed? Who can you trust? The Independent Engineers can't be trusted, and I've spent $800 already and have no way to be able to verify who is telling me the truth regarding what needs to be done and what type of repair will actually work. The foundation companies' websites explain why their competitor's products will fail. Who is telling the truth? Has anyone had their SA foundation repaired by Concrete peirs? If so, how long ago, and have you had to place a Warranty call? Same question regarding steel piers.
Any help/advise would be greatly appreicated. Thanks!
Hello LadyinSA,
Not to defend the first PE but Civil Engineering is a broad field to include the design and supervision of the construction of buildings as well as roads, dams, bridges, and a whole lot of other things. Many Civil Engineers will specialize in Structural Engineering and potentially other specialties. Structural Engineers are generally associated with the design and supervision in the construction of buildings (although there are other specialties in Structural Engineering).
Not sure how you determined that PE #1 had misrepresented himself. Here in Texas the Texas Board of Professional Engineers obviously is the license arm of PE's. You can look up the PE's license here Texas Board of Professional Engineers Homepage. Unfortunately this look-up lists only one specialty and the PE might have more. To find out what all they are considered qualified in you can call the TSBPE and ask. For example the Homer Parker mentioned below is license #54159 and is listed as a "Civil Engineer". As you can see from TrapperL's post Homer is apparently one of the best with regards to structural and foundation problems. No offense to Structural Engineers but from all I know of Civil Engineers they are more rounded and versed.
I know that does not help you but here is something that might. You appear to really be questioning the whole situation and most likely with good reason. The Foundation Performance Association (FPA) of Texas has a great site with a lot of really good information to help even non-technical homeowners to better understand foundations and their problems. If you can take it the technical pubs are not really that hard to digest and can answer some more of your questions. They also have an extensive member list by type such as Forensic Engineers, Geotechnical Engineers, suppliers, consultants, etc., etc. Their WEB site is Welcome to the Foundation Performance Association Web Site. From there you can also go to the various WEB sites of members to see what they have in the way of more friendly explanations and help.
What I find very curious is the use of the diagnosis that your foundation "failed". Did both PE's actually call the foundation out as failed or failing? Failed is such a drastic condition but then with the estimates you display it is hard to say.
I certainly wish I could recommend a PE for you but am not familiar with any specific ones in your area. Not sure what your financial condition is but calling a PE from well out of your area can obviously be expensive. What you can do is check the member list and papers to see if someone is well versed in your area. Many PE's are happy to discuss issues with you on the phone but do keep in mind until they actually come out they really can't tell you much. But you can at least get a feel for what they might be like.
Good luck and let others know if you find a good PE in your area. This drought is going to keep them busy!
This is one of those "I wish I had known you were looking for an engineer". You don't need a civil or a professional engineer, you need a forensic engineer. The best one in the the USA for this area is Homer Parker out of Round Rock. I've worked with Homer on a lot of homes in regards to failing foundations. But I assume you've already spent a lot and don't want to spend more. It can be frustrating dealing with these guys as most , frankly, don't have a clue about what they are doing....and some of them come with a big name.
In regards to the builder warranty, in Texas, if the house was built after 2003, any builder defect is warranted in perpetuity. But you are in the position to prove it was a defect. That's what a credible engineer can bring to the table, like Homer Parker.
What area of town or subdivision do you live in? When you purchased the house, did you receive documentation in regards to the Plasticity Index of the soil for you particular lot? It's been a required document for new home sales for several decades. You might go to the library at SAC and look into the soil reports by the Army Corps and see what the PI is versus the design of the slab- if it's not enough, there's your builder defect.
Thank you very much for the information. Homer Parker will be coming to my home soon to do an evaluation. In the meantime, I've been online with the library at SAC - they couldn't find anything. I am not the original owner of this home, so don't have the closing documents that might have contained the PI/soil content. To answer your question about location, I live near IH-10 & DeZavala. My home was built in 1997 so the builder defect problem is still a problem. Previously, I contacted the City of San Antonio trying to get a copy of the original Foundation Inspection report (Foundation Engineer's Letter with seal) but am still waiting for a return call. I'm wondering if that report would contain the soil information you are referring to. Also, do you think the original Title Company would have the soil information in their closing documents? I might be able to gather this information that way. I'll keep you posted. Thanks again for your helpful suggestions...my home had another new crack last night (Horizontal this time). I've already had a plumber come out two weeks ago to verify that there are no plumbing leaks, so I seriously don't know what to do to stop the rate of destruction. By the way, the lst Engineer asked why we had soaker hoses around the perimeter of the foundation and said NOT to water at all. The second Engineer said to "turn them on the let them run." Nothing seems to be helping.
Last edited by LadyinSA; 08-31-2011 at 11:57 AM..
Reason: clarification
Not to defend the first PE but Civil Engineering is a broad field to include the design and supervision of the construction of buildings as well as roads, dams, bridges, and a whole lot of other things. Many Civil Engineers will specialize in Structural Engineering and potentially other specialties. Structural Engineers are generally associated with the design and supervision in the construction of buildings (although there are other specialties in Structural Engineering).
Not sure how you determined that PE #1 had misrepresented himself. Here in Texas the Texas Board of Professional Engineers obviously is the license arm of PE's. You can look up the PE's license here Texas Board of Professional Engineers Homepage. Unfortunately this look-up lists only one specialty and the PE might have more. To find out what all they are considered qualified in you can call the TSBPE and ask. For example the Homer Parker mentioned below is license #54159 and is listed as a "Civil Engineer". As you can see from TrapperL's post Homer is apparently one of the best with regards to structural and foundation problems. No offense to Structural Engineers but from all I know of Civil Engineers they are more rounded and versed.
I know that does not help you but here is something that might. You appear to really be questioning the whole situation and most likely with good reason. The Foundation Performance Association (FPA) of Texas has a great site with a lot of really good information to help even non-technical homeowners to better understand foundations and their problems. If you can take it the technical pubs are not really that hard to digest and can answer some more of your questions. They also have an extensive member list by type such as Forensic Engineers, Geotechnical Engineers, suppliers, consultants, etc., etc. Their WEB site is Welcome to the Foundation Performance Association Web Site. From there you can also go to the various WEB sites of members to see what they have in the way of more friendly explanations and help.
What I find very curious is the use of the diagnosis that your foundation "failed". Did both PE's actually call the foundation out as failed or failing? Failed is such a drastic condition but then with the estimates you display it is hard to say.
I certainly wish I could recommend a PE for you but am not familiar with any specific ones in your area. Not sure what your financial condition is but calling a PE from well out of your area can obviously be expensive. What you can do is check the member list and papers to see if someone is well versed in your area. Many PE's are happy to discuss issues with you on the phone but do keep in mind until they actually come out they really can't tell you much. But you can at least get a feel for what they might be like.
Good luck and let others know if you find a good PE in your area. This drought is going to keep them busy!
Hello,
Thank you very much for the excellent information. As mentioned in a previous post, I was able to get an appointment with Homer Parker. And yes, the lst Engineer documented that my home had foundation failure, the 2nd Engineer scoffed at that report. Ironically, I did go to the FPA website and that's how I located the 2nd Engineer. I'm still waiting for his report. In the meantime, last night, we noticed a new, horizontal crack in my kitchen area. It is really scary to have new cracks showing up every day. I don't know what's causing the rapid movement. I had the plumbing thoroughly checked two weeks ago and there were no leaks.
I will keep posting and let you all know what I find out. Maybe these exchanges will help others. Your advice and insights were very helpful!
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