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It only seems "jarring" because men have a tendency to underestimate a woman's weight (and we don't exactly correct you lol). Even my own brother thought I was LYING when I told him how much I weigh! And if anyone is happy to be brutally honest, it's a younger brother. And while our muscle mass might be lower on average, that means our fat content is typically higher - with buxom women especially, we can be holding an extra 10-20lbs just in the bosoms. Point being, I don't think 170lbs on a not-short woman is as large as you think it is.
At any rate, your dating history doesn't mean much. Perhaps you just like a smaller woman? I like a larger man, so most of the men I date are "pretty easily" over 200lbs; still wouldn't be rudely shocked over men being thin like you. We come in all shapes and sizes, and 170/190lbs isn't necessarily unhealthy. Depends on the person.
Dating history only matters in that it probably serves to bias me. One of my best female friends (platonically) was, by any reasonable standard, obese, at least 250 lbs. She moved to Los Angeles over a decade ago to work on a TV show, and I have no idea what she looks like now. We're both social media dropouts, heh. But yeah, dating-wise, I'd imagine the average person I've 'gone out' with has been around 130 lbs or so. I could be wrong though--you're probably right about men's tendency to underestimate women's weight
Our conversation here is probably considered a derail of a great debates thread, but...so be it? Phetaroi had low expectations for the longevity of the thread as it was, hah.
I have my doubts that this thread will last long...but...
I was thinking of my childhood back in the 1950s and early 1960s. Did we have some truly nutty people in my hometown of about 3,000? Sure we did. But not as many as you might have now. But I think there was a simple reason for that. Some of the nuttiest were in asylums. We had one neighbor that had been in an asylum due to a nervous breakdown. Today, it's doubtful such a person would be put in an asylum.
You have the timing about right there. Back during the Kennedy administration some of the new anti-depressant drugs (ones that ironically are almost never prescribed today as they are considered obsolete and relatively ineffective) had come along and someone convinced politicians that mental health issues could be medicated away. So this began a trend of closing mental institutions and "mainstreaming" the inmates (nice way of saying, put them out on the street).
Now you have to have some pretty serious mental health issues to qualify for therapy, much less get committed someplace. You pretty much have to be running around naked with a lampshade on your head to even raise an eyebrow.
And you're right, it is sad. Just yesterday my wife was shopping at a local store and went into the ladies room and found a young lady in there weeping inconsolably. She had just been fired from that store. She explained that she had mental health issues and try as she might could not show up some days to work as she just wasn't functioning. My wife did her best to comfort her and give her some encouragement, but this is what happens when people aren't properly tended to when they need it; they try hard to function but they can't always hold down a job and things spiral downward from there.
I'm sure there are a lot of people doing somewhat better than that who are just barely scraping by; they are able to hold a job and "act normal" but they are certainly not enjoying life. My son was like that ... he wasn't "sick enough" to get any real help and that eventually killed him. In a sense he died because he was able to function well enough to hold down a job (albeit, underemployed in crummy jobs) and so he was considered to be fine. The local mental health department wanted to medicate his problems away when he needed therapy and supervised living arrangements. After enough time he made increasingly bad decisions, and the rest is history.
You're also right that a lot of it is the normalization of people indulging every logical fallacy under the sun in the service of politics and religion and conspiracy theories, with the result that increasingly many live in their own world and you try to penetrate that world at your own risk. Even otherwise mentally okay people have divorced their decision-making and opinion-forming processes from actual lived experience and reality ... they have been turned into followers of baseless assertions essentially. So they hold mutually exclusive viewpoints without awareness or irony, they do things contrary to their own rational self interest all the time ... if you are not one of those people if is difficult to have a pleasant interchange with someone like that.
You have the timing about right there. Back during the Kennedy administration some of the new anti-depressant drugs (ones that ironically are almost never prescribed today as they are considered obsolete and relatively ineffective) had come along and someone convinced politicians that mental health issues could be medicated away. So this began a trend of closing mental institutions and "mainstreaming" the inmates (nice way of saying, put them out on the street).
Now you have to have some pretty serious mental health issues to qualify for therapy, much less get committed someplace. You pretty much have to be running around naked with a lampshade on your head to even raise an eyebrow.
And you're right, it is sad. Just yesterday my wife was shopping at a local store and went into the ladies room and found a young lady in there weeping inconsolably. She had just been fired from that store. She explained that she had mental health issues and try as she might could not show up some days to work as she just wasn't functioning. My wife did her best to comfort her and give her some encouragement, but this is what happens when people aren't properly tended to when they need it; they try hard to function but they can't always hold down a job and things spiral downward from there.
I'm sure there are a lot of people doing somewhat better than that who are just barely scraping by; they are able to hold a job and "act normal" but they are certainly not enjoying life. My son was like that ... he wasn't "sick enough" to get any real help and that eventually killed him. In a sense he died because he was able to function well enough to hold down a job (albeit, underemployed in crummy jobs) and so he was considered to be fine. The local mental health department wanted to medicate his problems away when he needed therapy and supervised living arrangements. After enough time he made increasingly bad decisions, and the rest is history.
You're also right that a lot of it is the normalization of people indulging every logical fallacy under the sun in the service of politics and religion and conspiracy theories, with the result that increasingly many live in their own world and you try to penetrate that world at your own risk. Even otherwise mentally okay people have divorced their decision-making and opinion-forming processes from actual lived experience and reality ... they have been turned into followers of baseless assertions essentially. So they hold mutually exclusive viewpoints without awareness or irony, they do things contrary to their own rational self interest all the time ... if you are not one of those people if is difficult to have a pleasant interchange with someone like that.
The class of antidepressants you're referring to in your first paragraph are called tricyclics. My dad had a serious bout of catatonic depression in the spring of 2019 (I'm not sure there's such a thing as an unserious bout of catatonic depression, but), and he's done a few stints in the psych ward since. In early 2022, he spent basically the entire month of February in the psych ward, and a since-retired old-school psychiatrist put him on Nortriptyline, which is a tricyclic. The doctor claimed that he'd seen better outcomes for older people on Nortriptyline (my dad would've been age 71 at the time). I asked a good friend of mine about the drug, having never heard of it. My friend is a Buffalo native, now a pharmacist/pharmacy manager in the DC exurbs. He scoffed at the idea of anyone being prescribed Nortriptyline in 2022, called out Buffalo for being behind the times. Generally true though that is, I think the prescribing decision was mostly a function of the age of the prescriber.
My dad seemed to do pretty well on the drug for roughly a year and a half; he then decided to taper off the drug without having received 'permission' to do so, and that's when his troubles resurfaced
Hmmm. It is just you. The real number is 84.7%. Not 90%.
Or not. In the past six months I have had numerous casual conversations with neighbors, etc. Nothing weird. At all. But the only meaningful conversations I have are with my family.
I grew up learning not to talk, because the consequences were horrific ( abusive father ). When I left home at 17 I had to learn how to talk with classmates, etc. And I did. What I learned was to listen, be interested in what "they" are saying, but not discuss religion ( yes I am saved, thank you ) or politics ( in those days it was all about the Vietnam War ).
So now I am quite personable, but I still have no need for anyone to believe as I do. So I can listen and not comment on divisive topics ( except of course here on CD where I only not comment most of the time, but not all the time ).
I've lived in at least half the states in the US, and while there were differences in culture and ethnic backgrounds, people seemed to be about the same wherever you went. By that I mean, if you happened to strike up a conversation on public transit, or on the plane/train, or in a restaurant, people seemed OK mentally. Invariably, you had something in common w/ them. But for the last few years, the vast majority of people I talk to are half crazy. So this is not a local thing, it seems to be a trend.
Sometimes I wonder if I went to sleep and woke up on another planet. You can't talk politics w/ people because very weird stuff happens. Now that's a tricky subject anyway, but that's just one example. Nowadays, 2 or 3 minutes into a conversation w/ these folks I either start agreeing w/ them in the hope that will let them wind down, or I do the fake phone call thing just so I can bow out gracefully, if not honestly. People have certainly changed physically. Just look at youtube videos of bands in the 60's 80's. Everyone looks like they should gain about 30 lbs, but I think this was the normal back in the day. Now, a lot of people look poofed up. Maybe its due to the growth hormones we ingest when we eat factory farmed livestock?
Has it always been like this? It seems I would have noticed if it was. But my experiences say there are a lot of people running around that appear normal, but you quickly see they're off in another zone.
Could it be the common denomenator of interacting with you? Maybe you are the half crazy one. My mother told me when I was a kid you never talk politics or religion with strangers. Maybe you need to heed that advice. Talk about your kids, your work, your education, your hobbies, but politics it not something you talk about with strangers. Of course if they don't agree with you, you will think they are half crazy. And yes, our natural diet has been hijacked so most people are a little of not a lot "poofed up". It is due to a lot of things, lack of exercise, highly processed food, excessive food, etc.
I guess it depends on what you mean by "weird stuff happening" two minutes in to any conversation.
I mean, we're only a couple minutes into this conversation, and you have already told us you believe everyone is "poofed up" because we're all eating growth hormones given to factory farmed livestock. I think that is a pretty fringe idea to start a conversation with a stranger with.
So what would you think is weird?
A majority of the people I see in public are fat. And I mean FAT, not plump which some people were in the past. Fat as in 100 lbs. overweight.
Another thing, almost everyone is yakking on their phone now. Doesn't matter if they're driving a 4000 pound vehicle or a shopping cart or a bicycle or just walking down the street, the majority have little to no awareness of their surroundings.
I work with the public and I see the opposite, 90% are just fine. However, that 10% certainly includes those with mental issues and/or drug use. There's always the slight danger of violence so I need to be careful. Yesterday I had to have a conversation with a drugged out desperate person about money. It was just him and me. Unfortunately I think more people will become desperate and more aggressive as the economy continues to worsen in many areas.
As for the truly mentally ill, it's possible to get temporary placement in facilities or psych wards in hospitals. Long term placement is extremely difficult to get. We just have to keep in mind that the strangers we encounter may not be healthy.
And for the few that have strange and different views on things, well, I just humor them. Quirky is okay.
Could it be the common denomenator of interacting with you? Maybe you are the half crazy one. My mother told me when I was a kid you never talk politics or religion with strangers. Maybe you need to heed that advice.
Seriously, who does that? Or even in the workplace? I've read so many comments about how Seattle is so "politically correct" that anyone right of extreme Left gets run out of town. Well, after living there for 20 years, I don't recall having a single conversation with anyone about politics. There's so much more to talk about and bond over, it just never came up as a topic.
OP, are you provoking people? What do you have to offer conversationally? It's a big,fascinating world out there with an endless variety of topics. If someone tries to drag you into a political discussion or harangue, just state quietly but firmly, that it's your personal policy to not discuss politics or religion. How hard can that be? Outside of the Bible Belt, that is.
You have the timing about right there. Back during the Kennedy administration some of the new anti-depressant drugs (ones that ironically are almost never prescribed today as they are considered obsolete and relatively ineffective) had come along and someone convinced politicians that mental health issues could be medicated away. So this began a trend of closing mental institutions and "mainstreaming" the inmates (nice way of saying, put them out on the street).
You're also right that a lot of it is the normalization of people indulging every logical fallacy under the sun in the service of politics and religion and conspiracy theories, with the result that increasingly many live in their own world and you try to penetrate that world at your own risk. Even otherwise mentally okay people have divorced their decision-making and opinion-forming processes from actual lived experience and reality ... they have been turned into followers of baseless assertions essentially. So they hold mutually exclusive viewpoints without awareness or irony, they do things contrary to their own rational self interest all the time ... if you are not one of those people if is difficult to have a pleasant interchange with someone like that.
A couple of thoughts to add is that era saw the increase in behavioral "science" in how policies were formed. It slide into everything from business to education to parenting. With a lot of policy based on some very shaky "science." Becomes had to tell what is legit from pseudo because it gets they toss in some math and wrap it up in the trappings of "science" but much is not replicable or, even worse, outright fraudulent. (Franchesca Gino for example)
Quote:
Originally Posted by KaraG
I work with the public and I see the opposite, 90% are just fine. However, that 10% certainly includes those with mental issues and/or drug use. There's always the slight danger of violence so I need to be careful. Yesterday I had to have a conversation with a drugged out desperate person about money. It was just him and me. Unfortunately I think more people will become desperate and more aggressive as the economy continues to worsen in many areas.
I agree it's a small percentage. But a very vocal and self confident small percentage. Like trying to reason with a flat earther. On the one had, you could say they're harmless but on the other, consider how flawed their logic processes are and then consider they vote, advocate, make business decisions that impact others.
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And while our muscle mass might be lower on average, that means our fat content is typically higher - with buxom women especially, we can be holding an extra 10-20lbs just in the bosoms. Point being, I don't think 170lbs on a not-short woman is as large as you think it is.
