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In my experience, most Christians are completely un-troubled in any meaningful way by the realization that most humans throughout most of history are doomed. Even their own relatives. Because all they actually care about is that they are part of the few, the proud, the elect.
To my own shame, I took this attitude myself. Completely dismissed the fate of anyone who didn't believe as I did, because of the conceit that I had happened upon the One Correct Hermeneutic for understanding the One True Scripture and the One True God, and that I somehow deserved it as my inheritance (because that's what the NT teaches).
I think this is because most Christians, (like most non-Christians), refuse to entertain the fact that an eternity in hell is actually a real possibility for them. Once a person realizes that they themselves are in grave danger of hell at any given moment, it tends to change one's perspective.
This is only one reason that the "once saved, always saved" doctrine is so dangerous and destructive.
I think this is because most Christians, (like most non-Christians), refuse to entertain the fact that an eternity in hell is actually a real possibility for them. Once a person realizes that they themselves are in grave danger of hell at any given moment, it tends to change one's perspective.
This is only one reason that the "once saved, always saved" doctrine is so dangerous and destructive.
I can show you eternal security passages in the NT, but you wouldn't accept them and would try to explain them away.
I think this is because most Christians, (like most non-Christians), refuse to entertain the fact that an eternity in hell is actually a real possibility for them. Once a person realizes that they themselves are in grave danger of hell at any given moment, it tends to change one's perspective.
This is only one reason that the "once saved, always saved" doctrine is so dangerous and destructive.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Michael Way
I can show you eternal security passages in the NT, but you wouldn't accept them and would try to explain them away.
What if there was a religion in another country whose global market penetration matched that of Christianity and their theology taught that hell didn't exist? And their followers were convinced their religion was the truth?
Assuming Christianity is true and hell exists, how do we define "hell"? what is hell? I'm sure our answers will be based off two things: our interpretation of scripture and what we have learned from the denomination we follow and this assumes the denomination we follow has interpretated scripture correctly.
As Michael said, we might have different interpretations of scripture and convince ourselves that our own interpretation is correct. EscalaMike has openly admitted in the past that he will refuse and deny any theology that goes against the Catholic Church.
I am not aware of a time in history when Christianity was a greater share of the world population than it is now -- and it's losing ground to Islam as well; according to Pew Research, within 2 or 3 decades there will be fewer Christians than Muslims and those two religions will trade places in that regard.
Given that "god is not willing that ANY should perish but that ALL should come to repentance", that's a pretty poor showing. Especially when you consider how many people throughout history have never "come to repentance". There are only a few possibilities here:
1) 100% of non-Christians reflects their disinterest, lack of caring, or outright rebellion against god, therefore, eternal perdition is just punishment.
2) 100% of non-Christians reflects god's disinterest in THEM. See: Calvinism.
3) The evangel isn't as compelling as Christians like to think that it is. Like a Star Trek fan who can't understand why everyone doesn't know the name of the captain who preceded Kirk on the Enterprise and isn't interested in learning to speak Klingonese, Christians think their ideology is self-evidently correct and compelling, but it's not.
3b) The evangel is compelling, actually, but the church is inept at communicating / selling it.
4) Through some interminable, arduous process, somehow everyone will eventually be redeemed.
5) It doesn't matter because all religions are a path to god.
6) It doesn't matter because some non-Christian religion or quasi-Christian sect of questionable dogma is the actual answer.
7) It's all holy horse-pucky -- god, devils, sin, redemption, all of it.
Maybe I've missed a possibility, but I suspect most here subscribe to one of those explanations.
I'll take #4 for $200, Alex.
At least that's what my missionary relatives believe. How that will play out is anyone's guess.
I doubt that Paul even knew that Ireland (or China, India, or Australia) even existed. We also know there were people in the Americas at that time, but there is no reason to think Paul ever preached to them. I think he referred to the AME, which is probably all that anybody knew existed.
Many times in the Bible the term "World" is used, but indicates only the ANE (or AME) they existed in.
Like the flood, probably was just a near-East event. But to them, that was "the world".
The missionary organizations do say they are getting "close" to reaching most of the world with the message. Now whether many accept it, is another thing. Especially with the Muslim restrictions/influence.
What if there was a religion in another country whose global market penetration matched that of Christianity and their theology taught that hell didn't exist? And their followers were convinced their religion was the truth?
Death exists universally among humans. This is an objective fact. Death is the fundamental human problem. Christianity promises salvation from eternal death.
I would ask: Does this other religion promise salvation from eternal death? If so, by what means?
Assuming Christianity is true and hell exists, how do we define "hell"? what is hell? I'm sure our answers will be based off two things: our interpretation of scripture and what we have learned from the denomination we follow and this assumes the denomination we follow has interpretated scripture correctly.
Why does the bolded matter? I don't think anyone defines hell as "pleasant". It's undesirable. As a principle, it need not be any more complicated than that.
Yes, because otherwise we are trying to get there/stay there on our own merits.
Exactly. The reality is either our salvation depends on what Jesus did for us, and thus relying on him, or our salvation depends on us and our efforts. It can't be both but is one or the other. Grace means that our salvation is dependent upon God alone.
Are we supposed to believe that a young woman who lived and died in Alaska during the time of Jesus knew who God was?
There's this idea that those who did not learn or made aware of Jesus or God was made aware of it after they died? meaning there is a "special place" where they learn about God and given the opportunity to accept God. Lets fast forward to modern times... Christianity has only penetrated 31% of the world. What if there is a person in Jamaica that is not affected at all by Christianity?
Yes, all will be given the opportunity to hear the gospel of Jesus Christ, fully understand it and choose to either accept or reject it. If they don't have this opportunity during their mortal life, then they (i.e., in spirit form) will have that opportunity during the time between their death and their resurrection.
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