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It won't, if they've put up a wall against it. There's a block. Sometimes it's the only way to deal with it. You may be a very loving person, but that part of your heart can be hardened so it doesn't feel the immense pain that it WOULD feel if that person believes in the doctrine of eternal torment or annihilation. Hardened = numbed. Can't truly feel it. Only on a very very surface level. It doesn't have to be that way. When you feel what you actually believe, that is when the layers start to peel back, and the true nature of our Creator starts to slowly come into focus. If the heart is numbed to that very specific belief and what it really means, you're not going to get past it. That novacaine your heart has been injected with in order to survive and function, MUST be allowed to wear off. You HAVE to feel it, so you can get to the truth of the matter. There's no way around it. Everything in it's due time, I suppose.
Beautifully stated on a very complex and tricky issue
When you worship God DRob4JC, how do you muster up any kind of enthusiasm for someone who denies most of His creation access to the very source of life because they were unbelievers? Do you ever fear He might smite you as well? You can get excited about this type of Deity? Really?
God is not denying eternal life to anyone. Jesus died for all. But a transaction of faith is required to access salvation. Jesus did not teach universal salvation. See John 3.
OK. Good answer. For me, believing in UR, I am at much more peace now knowing that when I am in a crowd or crowded place, all these people I see are in good hands and each one known and loved by God. Before, I believed most of these people only had doom awaiting them. Some may not be bothered by that thought, but it bothered me.
You’re right, it should bother every Christian, to the point we MUST share the gospel with anyone who will listen.
You’re right, it should bother every Christian, to the point we MUST share the gospel with anyone who will listen.
The gospel was never bad news though
The religious powers and hierarchy and rulers have both a duty and responsibility regarding the gospel message and they are held to account for how they have promoted and distributed the gospel message, and used ‘people’ in that distribution
The Shepherds and the Angels
Luk 2:8**And there were in the same country shepherds abiding in the field, keeping watch over their flock by night.
Luk 2:9**And, lo, the angel of the Lord came upon them, and the glory of the Lord shone round about them: and they were sore afraid.
Luk 2:10**And the angel said unto them, Fear not: for, behold, I bring you good tidings of great joy, which shall be to all people.
Luk 2:11**For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.
You’re right, it should bother every Christian, to the point we MUST share the gospel with anyone who will listen.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meerkat2
The gospel was never bad news though
The religious powers have both a duty and responsibility regarding the gospel message and they are held to account for how they have promoted and distributed the gospel message
The Shepherds and the Angels
Luk 2:8**And there were in the same country shepherds abiding in the field, keeping watch over their flock by night.
Luk 2:9**And, lo, the angel of the Lord came upon them, and the glory of the Lord shone round about them: and they were sore afraid.
Luk 2:10**And the angel said unto them, Fear not: for, behold, I bring you good tidings of great joy, which shall be to all people.
Luk 2:11**For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.
^^^^ This.IS the Gospel message, NOT the Bad News "hellfire and brimstone" and "filthy rags" nonsense that is promoted in the dominant sacrificial "atonement" Christian Dogma!!!
OK. Good answer. For me, believing in UR, I am at much more peace now knowing that when I am in a crowd or crowded place, all these people I see are in good hands and each one known and loved by God. Before, I believed most of these people only had doom awaiting them. Some may not be bothered by that thought, but it bothered me.
This is my question for you... what happens if you are wrong and there is some semblance of a hell? Do you quit God? Do you still worship Him?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Horn of ‘83
You’re right, it should bother every Christian, to the point we MUST share the gospel with anyone who will listen.
Christ didn't seem to be bothered as He pronounced "woes" on certain people. He mentioned hell more than anyone else.
It's not that He doesn't care - because He died for the sins of the world. But if it's true - that there is a hell - it would be negligence if He didn't say anything about it.
I am not saying it needs to be part of a main gospel message. But we should know about it if it's true.
This is my question for you... what happens if you are wrong and there is some semblance of a hell? Do you quit God? Do you still worship Him?
Christ didn't seem to be bothered as He pronounced "woes" on certain people. He mentioned hell more than anyone else.
It's not that He doesn't care - because He died for the sins of the world. But if it's true - that there is a hell - it would be negligence if He didn't say anything about it.
I am not saying it needs to be part of a main gospel message. But we should know about it if it's true.
There are negative spiritual consequences for BECOMING a scum bag and that is what the warnings are about. They have nothing to do with the primitive imaginings of our ancestors (or of Dante) about punishment or eternal torment!
This is my question for you... what happens if you are wrong and there is some semblance of a hell? Do you quit God? Do you still worship Him?
Christ didn't seem to be bothered as He pronounced "woes" on certain people. He mentioned hell more than anyone else.
It's not that He doesn't care - because He died for the sins of the world. But if it's true - that there is a hell - it would be negligence if He didn't say anything about it.
I am not saying it needs to be part of a main gospel message. But we should know about it if it's true.
Answer to question in bold. -> I believe there is a hell, reserved for believers in hellfire and damnation and sociopaths. But it is not eternal. Since there is no time on the other side, it FEELS like eternity. If there really was an eternal hell and God sentenced (or allowed) most souls to be imprisoned and tortured forever....I would have nothing to do with such a deity. I personally believe the thought (ET) never even entered into the mind of God. God is love. A statement so simple a child can understand it. Love would not do something like eternally kill or torment someone, that is the opposite of love.
The concept of belief in God as accepting a specific set of "precepts and doctrines of men"
Before Jesus's "death" as a human Spirit, there was no place in Heaven for Abraham and those who preceded Jesus. They were in a kind of limbo (prison?). Jesus's "born again" human Spirit is identical to God's Holy Spirit and He created a place for all "born again" human Spirits as He promised. That is what saved us, NOT His crucifixion. The Cross was His "dying" message that God loves and forgives us no matter what we do in our ignorance and we need not fear "death." That is why He wanted us to remember Him on the Cross. We managed to screw that up and missed the point completely.
You are not only ON BASE with this one, but You also Hit A Home Run.
188:4.1 (2016.6) Although Jesus did not die this death on the cross to atone for the racial guilt of mortal man nor to provide some sort of effective approach to an otherwise offended and unforgiving God; even though the Son of Man did not offer himself as a sacrifice to appease the wrath of God and to open the way for sinful man to obtain salvation; notwithstanding that these ideas of atonement and propitiation are erroneous, nonetheless, there are significances attached to this death of Jesus on the cross which should not be overlooked. It is a fact that Urantia has become known among other neighboring inhabited planets as the “World of the Cross.”
188:4.2 (2016.7) Jesus desired to live a full mortal life in the flesh on Urantia. Death is, ordinarily, a part of life. Death is the last act in the mortal drama. In your well-meant efforts to escape the superstitious errors of the false interpretation of the meaning of the death on the cross, you should be careful not to make the great mistake of failing to perceive the true significance and the genuine import of the Master’s death.
188:4.3 (2016.8) Mortal man was never the property of the archdeceivers. Jesus did not die to ransom man from the clutch of the apostate rulers and fallen princes of the spheres. The Father in heaven never conceived of such crass injustice as damning a mortal soul because of the evil-doing of his ancestors. Neither was the Master’s death on the cross a sacrifice which consisted in an effort to pay God a debt which the race of mankind had come to owe him.
188:4.4 (2016.9) Before Jesus lived on earth, you might possibly have been justified in believing in such a God, but not since the Master lived and died among your fellow mortals. Moses taught the dignity and justice of a Creator God; but Jesus portrayed the love and mercy of a heavenly Father.
The cross does stand as the token of the highest form of unselfish service, the supreme devotion of the full bestowal of a righteous life in the service of wholehearted ministry, even in death, the death of the cross. And the very sight of this great symbol of the bestowal life of Jesus truly inspires all of us to want to go and do likewise.
188:5.11 (2019.4) Make sure, then, that when you view the cross as a revelation of God, you do not look with the eyes of the primitive man nor with the viewpoint of the later barbarian, both of whom regarded God as a relentless Sovereign of stern justice and rigid law-enforcement. Rather, make sure that you see in the cross the final manifestation of the love and devotion of Jesus to his life
There are negative spiritual consequences for BECOMING a scum bag and that is what the warnings are about. They have nothing to do with the primitive imaginings of our ancestors (or of Dante) about punishment or eternal torment!
It seems ironic to criticize the church when it is the only reason you or I or anyone today has any interest in Jesus or the Bible.
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