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What you call poster boys/girls are real people giving their real testimonies about how Christ changed their lives. Maybe they are just much happier where they are in life, and they WANT to share their testimony and give God glory ... which by the way God encourages his followers to do.
You know, with perhaps the exception of one or two that I heard during my tenure with 'the Church', personal testimonies generally bored me to tears as they most always focused on the teller and as to how 'holy' they had now become. Most of these testimonies were 'narcissism' (even if unintentional) in a thinly veiled disguise of 'modest piety'. This is how they came across to me anyway even if they impressed most everyone else. Whenever anyone got up to 'share their testimony' my first reaction would pretty much be ...
Alright, yet again ...one's innate sexual orientation, which means that one's innate (i.e. natural) tendency is the attraction to (some) others of the same sex, is not - CANNOT BE! - 'a sin'. It may be seen to be 'disordered' as our Catholic brethren like to tell us because it deviates 'from the norm', but it is NOT 'a wrong'. 'Left-handedness' is also 'disordered' (but not 'a sin') and one can practice enough times with their right hand until IT becomes the prominent hand while others choose to remain 'left-handed' for the rest of their lives.
Those ones who can't wait to share their testimony as to how 'Jesus saved them from the sin of homosexuality' - plus the churches that also can't wait to use these testimonies to 'authenticate' their own teaching on the subject - MAY WELL be either phonies or otherwise sincerely duped into believing that 'they are cured of the sin of homosexuality'.
Any person who was born with a tendency toward homosexuality will RETAIN that homosexual tendency throughout their lives even while claiming to 'have been cured'. 'Jesus' has NOTHING to do with one's equally inbuilt ability to convince themselves and to convince others that 'a change' has indeed occurred. The 'guilt' placed on the LGBT Community and the constant judgmentalism of the mainstream Christian Church toward homosexuality is a powerful incentive for those so 'disordered' (?) to force a change on themselves if only in appearance. And, as I think most of us are aware, this HAS occurred many times only for one's 'real self' to be revealed at a later date.
WHATEVER, these so-called testimonies ARE personal and SHOULD NOT be used as a means to vilify or to shame others of the LGBT Community with the message that 'they are living in sin'!
You know, with perhaps the exception of one or two that I heard during my tenure with 'the Church', personal testimonies generally bored me to tears as they most always focused on the teller and as to how 'holy' they had now become. Most of these testimonies were 'narcissism' (even if unintentional) in a thinly veiled disguise of 'modest piety'. This is how they came across to me anyway even if they impressed most everyone else. Whenever anyone got up to 'share their testimony' my first reaction would pretty much be ...
Your boredom may be someone else's inspiration. *shrug*
Quote:
Originally Posted by RomulusXXV
Alright, yet again ...one's innate sexual orientation, which means that one's innate (i.e. natural) tendency is the attraction to (some) others of the same sex, is not - CANNOT BE! - 'a sin'. It may be seen to be 'disordered' as our Catholic brethren like to tell us because it deviates 'from the norm', but it is NOT 'a wrong'. 'Left-handedness' is also 'disordered' (but not 'a sin') and one can practice enough times with their right hand until IT becomes the prominent hand while others choose to remain 'left-handed' for the rest of their lives.
God sets the terms - not us. It's clear in multiple mentions of Scripture that God doesn't like it.
And if that's not enough the design and fit of the physical parts should indicate how the sexes interact.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RomulusXXV
Those ones who can't wait to share their testimony as to how 'Jesus saved them from the sin of homosexuality' - plus the churches that also can't wait to use these testimonies to 'authenticate' their own teaching on the subject - MAY WELL be either phonies or otherwise sincerely duped into believing that 'they are cured of the sin of homosexuality'.
Your opinion...
I guess you will tell me next that those who promote homosexuality are the only genuine ones.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RomulusXXV
Any person who was born with a tendency toward homosexuality will RETAIN that homosexual tendency throughout their lives even while claiming to 'have been cured'. 'Jesus' has NOTHING to do with one's equally inbuilt ability to convince themselves and to convince others that 'a change' has indeed occurred. The 'guilt' placed on the LGBT Community and the constant judgmentalism of the mainstream Christian Church toward homosexuality is a powerful incentive for those so 'disordered' (?) to force a change on themselves if only in appearance. And, as I think most of us are aware, this HAS occurred many times only for one's 'real self' to be revealed at a later date.
I disagree about retaining certain behaviors... behavior can always change.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RomulusXXV
WHATEVER, these so-called testimonies ARE personal and SHOULD NOT be used as a means to vilify or to shame others of the LGBT Community with the message that 'they are living in sin'!
God wants people to share how He blesses them. We can't control how others receive a message. The shame may be coming from one's own internal conscience.
I provided four testimonies. There was no shame in those videos. So I am not sure why you are directing that towards me.
I don't have any angst. In a topic that's pushing 30,000 comments, I probably have about 20-30 posts... maybe 40 now. There's more angst with people defending it who have been on this topic most of the time.
In the marriage environment, sex is essential. It also sustains life. All other sex is carnal and sinful. One's state of mind doesn't matter. God sets the terms.
Well, in my opinion, you are letting our ignorant, primitive, and savage ancestors' interpretations of God set the terms. As Jesus said, "They know not what they do."
My approach to the thread topic - Christianity and the LGBTQ Community - is that of 'live and let live'. Gay people don't appear to be causing any more harm to society - or 'the Church' - than are 'straight' people.
Is it REALLY a concern - or even a thought to enter the mind - for those sharing a church pew with ANY person as to what their private sexual practices might be? How about envisaging intimacy between one's pastor and his wife? I would shudder at such an inappropriate thought entering my head. Same thing with gay people. Leave it alone and focus more on feeding the hungry, giving drink to the thirsty, clothing the naked, visiting the sick and those imprisoned, sheltering the homeless, etc. as advised by Jesus. We all know what we should be doing. Gay Christians should be doing this also. So should I.
My approach to the thread topic - Christianity and the LGBTQ Community - is that of 'live and let live'. Gay people don't appear to be causing any more harm to society - or 'the Church' - than are 'straight' people.
Is it REALLY a concern - or even a thought to enter the mind - for those sharing a church pew with ANY person as to what their private sexual practices might be? How about envisaging intimacy between one's pastor and his wife? I would shudder at such an inappropriate thought entering my head. Same thing with gay people. Leave it alone and focus more on feeding the hungry, giving drink to the thirsty, clothing the naked, visiting the sick and those imprisoned, sheltering the homeless, etc. as advised by Jesus. We all know what we should be doing. Gay Christians should be doing this also. So should I.
My approach to the thread topic - Christianity and the LGBTQ Community - is that of 'live and let live'. Gay people don't appear to be causing any more harm to society - or 'the Church' - than are 'straight' people.
Is it REALLY a concern - or even a thought to enter the mind - for those sharing a church pew with ANY person as to what their private sexual practices might be? How about envisaging intimacy between one's pastor and his wife? I would shudder at such an inappropriate thought entering my head. Same thing with gay people. Leave it alone and focus more on feeding the hungry, giving drink to the thirsty, clothing the naked, visiting the sick and those imprisoned, sheltering the homeless, etc. as advised by Jesus. We all know what we should be doing. Gay Christians should be doing this also. So should I.
There's a quote from the Bible... "A little leaven leavens the whole lump of dough." Galatians 5:19
Leaven is a reference to sin.
1 Corinthians 5:8 - Therefore let us celebrate the feast, not with old leaven, nor with the leaven of malice and wickedness, but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.
The whole point is that if you let in a little sin, it will eventually corrupt everything. Adam ate the fruit. 1600 years later, God pushed the reset button with the flood because of the total evil and corruption of the people.
Sexual sins are not exempt from this principle. Sin never just sits there and remains the same.
2008 is when California legislature pushed the legalization of same sex marriage to legal status (since the people voted against it). Today, it is widely accepted everywhere and is not even blinked at anymore. But what are the discussions today? Sex is being taught at schools... kids are encouraged to do gender change surgeries... pedophilia being normalized... when you start bringing kids into this, and they are being damaged, and society is being urged to accept it - is that good for the kids? Those damaged kids will be damaged adults. And if these things are accepted, what's next?
The United Methodist Church voted Wednesday to allow LGBTQ clergy to serve in the church, reversing a 40-year ban.
The church had forbidden "self-avowed homosexuals" from being ordained or appointed as clergy members.
But during a national conference this week, delegates voted 692-51 to overturn the ban without debate.
People at the conference in North Carolina sang hymns in celebration after the vote, the church said.
Attendees also eased restrictions on gay marriage, passing a measure to prevent clergy and churches from being penalized for performing or declining to perform same-sex weddings.
"With the approvals and acceptance of the things today...we're beginning to see the unwinding, unravelling, dismantling of the heterosexism, the homophobia, the hurt and the harm of the United Methodist Church," Rev David Meredith said to United Methodist News.
As the councilor states, the people of Cumberland are driven by very deep religious, conservative values which makes this particular event relevant to this thread.
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