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Again always the experts on oil city that have never lived there.
btw bmurphy you recently had a closed thread on negativity on florida but I see it is ok for you to trash oil city...interesting
I think that falls under the rule
Do as I say not as I do.
I really don't see bmurphy as bashing oil city, I have been reading this thread, know zilch about oil city, but I do see the point he is trying to make. Did you ever see the movie 'Money Pit'? Well that sums it up. When you don't have much to rely on in the way of funds, home ownership can be a nightmare. When my husband and I first married, we bought a house and spent every weekend and every spare dollar for the next ten years working on that house in one way or the other. As far as money out the window, I know an ungodly amount of my mortgage payment every month is interest, talk about money out the window I am on my 3rd home, after 25 years of marriage and so far, besides living in a house instead of an apartment, home ownership still has not been a great advantage.
Seriously. Home ownership is expensive and a lot of money goes right out the window. Just because you have a CHANCE of profiting from your home eventually doesn't mean you don't throw out a lot of money for many years. Renting can be good esp. if you have a low amount of money like NAH. I'm guessing ONE person told him rent was bad and now he'll never change his mind...
Again always the experts on oil city that have never lived there.
btw bmurphy you recently had a closed thread on negativity on florida but I see it is ok for you to trash oil city...interesting
I think that falls under the rule
Do as I say not as I do.
Actually, most of my posts aren't about Oil City, in general, I was warning him that home ownership is more than just buying the house. I'm not trashing it, but the facts are there - it's a declining place probably continuing to decline. Sorry you have sour grapes about my Florida thread, but that doesn't mean Oil City is some nirvana, and encouraging NAH will only lead him to live in that rusty declining city. Besides - there was no reason to bring up my Florida thread here. This is why threads get closed.
BTW, he even told me if he had more money he'd not consider Oil City and he's looking into other places. Obviously, it's getting to be a bad idea even in HIS mind.
This document is lengthy and will be presented in two parts A & B, but I believe it addresses what Need affordable home is asking for. It’s apparent that many did not. It seems many were representing “knowledge” from afar (before anyone gets offended - it’s a shoe fits sort of thing). The thread is “calling everyone who knows about Oil City, PA.” Here goes.
Let me introduce myself, I’m Scott and I live in Oil City, Background: Grew up here but left in 1973 for military service and then lived in both North and South Carolina for the next 33 years. I periodically returned for visits with family and friends throughout that period. Moved back in March 2006 (always wanted to come home, so I’m somewhat biased) and purchased a single story home listed as a bungalow.
My impression:
Economy
As indicated by others, Oil City had a thriving economy prior to the late 70’s based on the oil, steel, and coal industries. There were supporting industries and businesses as is usually the case and a lot of locally owned businesses. The recessions of the late 70’s and 80’s apparently struck a hard blow. Major manufacturing mostly dried up, big oil went west although there is still production of oil and gas in the area. It is a small town, always has been, although smaller now.
Today there is still manufacturing (although smaller) in the area. Many local businesses have fallen do to the Wal-Marts, Home Depots, and other such mega-corporate intrusions. This is not, however, unique to Oil City as many of you readers can probably attest. Emphasis is being placed on luring business and industry to the area with some success. Technology based companies have been created too.
Emphasis has also been placed on economic development of Tourism and Recreation potentials. Many of you have commented on the natural beauty of this area.
For job info in the area, check www.thederrick.com/ classifieds and http://www.pacareerlink.state.pa.us/...er/jobseek.asp (PA’s version of an Employment Security Commission for us older folks), click on Search For Jobs, on new page scroll down and select a county (Venango, for Oil City) and click Search Jobs. Civil Service and Non-Civil Service jobs can be viewed at www.scsc.state.pa.us/scsc/site/default.asp (broken link) and www.hrm.state.pa.us/oahrm/cwp/view.asp?A=136&Q=82995&oahrmNav=| respectively. And finally, don’t forget employment agencies such as: Manpower, Kelly Services, All Seasons, and others.
Culture
I can’t really comment intelligently about this. Although I have been to an opera (just one), attended some theater, visited museums and galleries in my lifetime; I personally don’t thrive on such things. There is growing support through an Arts Council to advance opportunities to attract artists. I suppose culture is a mental state that every individual develops for themselves. Of course a town of this size can’t compete on a scale that larger cities can and do. I believe this is universal. For example, I lived in Camden, South Carolina. Camden had a community theater, some arts, and bi-annual Steeplechase horse racing. If you wanted more variety and big ticket venues, you had to travel to Columbia, Charleston, Greenville, and, naturally, Myrtle Beach.
So for those considering a move from a “metropolitan area,” I suppose they could experience “culture shock.” Be realistic in your expectations.
Climate
Growing up I recall some high humidity in late summer and as a rule of thumb, not seeing your lawn from Thanksgiving to near Easter. However, things aren’t just like they used to be. It’s not uncommon to not even have snow on the ground on Christmas Day (a tragedy since I like snow and Christmas) as was the case in 2006 and based on communications with family/friends over my years of absence. Global warming?
I have nearly a full year under my belt back here now. Last spring was great, the summer good until late (I don’t do well in heat and high humidity), the fall colorful and cool, and a nice, albeit late winter.
Outdoor Recreation
If you like fishing (non-saltwater) there are plenty fish in the brooks, streams, creeks (pronounced “crick”), rivers, ponds, and lakes in the area. The water often is crystal clear. However, because of mining, oil, and other past activities contamination is an issue. Drinking the water and eating fish should be investigated. But there are free flowing springs at highway pull-offs that I believe are maintained by PENNDOT.
Hunting is also popular if that’s your thing. I personally don’t participate. “nuff said.
Naturally, there are lots of camping, hiking, bicycling, and boating opportunities in the area in both formal and informal settings.
Structured sports, primarily baseball and soccer are available.
Housing (the big topic of discussion)
First, let me say that cheap, moderate, and expensive can be factual, conceptual, and relative terms. It stems from your starting point: the area in which you currently live and the properties there (factual), your ideas of a nice home (conceptual), and what expectations you have for services offered, benefits received for cost expended (relative). These are but examples; you can substitute and add to my observations as you see fit.
There are lots of cheap homes in certain neighborhoods of the city. A lot are “fixer-uppers” in varying conditions. But there are many that are livable but older structures. There are abandoned and condemned structures as well. Isn’t that true to some extent in the majority of communities?
There are very “nice” homes that command higher prices.
Although most people probably view urban flight in terms of large metropolitan cities, it exists also on a smaller scale here. The truly cheaper (basically, the oldest – like mine) houses are located closer to the city’s core. As you fan out, the housing becomes increasingly newer construction with increasing prices. There are neighborhoods/areas of more growth than others.
My Home: An Example
I am single and don’t need much room. As stated at the outset, I purchased a small bungalow. It is a single story with basement, has living, dining, kitchen, and two bedrooms along with a small-to-medium bathroom. The house had new siding (vinyl), exterior foam insulation, and a new roof installed in 2000. It has an old gas furnace which is not very efficient by today’s standards. I plan on replacing it at an approximate cost of $2500. Coming in at 803 sqft (living area) and 640 sqft basement (partially finished) on 0.14 acre, I paid $26,000. That comes to $32.38 per sqft. The appraised value is $27,480 (as of 2006) and total property taxes (city, county, and school) were $905 in 2006.
I live in what I feel is a nice neighborhood. Friendly neighbors (although not as friendly as when I grew up here), children, and fairly well kept homes and lawns,
My monthly payment for a 10 year loan (6.25%) is $369 which includes principle, interest, and escrow (for taxes and insurance). I am on a fixed income and find this amount easy to swing. Perhaps others could have negotiated a better purchase price and loan. Bottom line, I’m happy with my decision and terms.
Crime
Yeah, it’s here. Most of the serious stuff seems to be drugs. Big surprise, huh! There are reports of gang activity on the rise. These seem to be most everywhere. I don’t run from it, I confront it. You have to sooner or later. Since this forum is on City-Data you surely have seen the crime statistics: 1 murder in the last 8 years. My belief is that theft and burglary are the two main problem areas and, again my belief, these are primarily due to drugs and low employment.
Being on a fixed income, I needed to estimate to the best of my ability what my moving and living expenses were going to be. Here’s my process:
Taxes – called local government agencies and went online to gather property, school, sales, income, and other taxes. I missed the per capita, but at $10 per year it didn’t exactly break me. In your case, you’ll want to investigate additional local taxes (see Local Taxes link below) pertaining to business/employment as well. An aside: SC has the same sales tax rate (6%) as PA. However, in SC the tax was applied to almost all purchases while in PA, as someone else mentioned, there is no sales tax on basics like food and clothing. That can add up to significant savings. Personal observation; food is for the most part similar in cost as in SC. Bonus: I like milk, a lot, and it runs about 35-40¢ less per gallon here and with no sales tax I spend an average of 60¢ less per gallon than in SC.
Utilities – Again, I contacted the utilities (Penelec, National Fuel, Verizon, and the City of Oil City). I requested not only the rates but the previous 12 month usage for each of the properties (I was interested in 6) in question. Don’t forget connection charges and deposits, if any. An aside: There is DSL (Verizon) and Cable Internet (Comcast – formerly Adelphia) but you need to inquire availability by street address or current phone number of property.
Vehicle – Driver’s License, Vehicle Inspection, Vehicle Registration/Title. A standard Class C Driver’s license is $26 for 3 years, inspection averages $26 (plus cost of repairs to bring vehicle into compliance if necessary), and registration/title cost me $165 (included Notary and processing fees). Registration is variable as to vehicle type and weight. Another aside: In SC registration for my pickup was $11 per year while in PA it is $58.25 per year. However, my auto insurance was halved from about $600 per year in SC to $343 for essentially the same coverage; so the registration is pretty moot to me. Also, if I remember correctly, Florida has state operated inspection facilities while here it’s performed by private businesses such as auto repair and body shops.
Those are the biggies, there are others (cable, etc.) Don’t forget to call insurance companies for quotes on homeowners and vehicle coverage both separately and combined. You probably have others based on your lifestyle and business.
Also remember the cost of moving (U-Haul, lodging, meals, etc.), it can add up. Lock in rental rates (U-Haul) as early as possible before your move date. This locks in availability of vehicle/trailer and rate. You can also check back periodically online as the move date nears and if rates have come down, cancel original reservation and rebook.
I have never owned a “stick-built” home before (and I suspect the same of you). Familiarizing myself with the terms, conditions, phases, and loan process was a real learning curve, but well worth the investigative effort. Don’t be afraid to ask questions of realtors and bankers. Real Estate transactions are highly regulated activities and it would be hard to be taken advantage of. Ask multiple realtors and bankers the same question(s) to get a good consensus.
Medical
Don’t expect major specialty hospitals/services to be here. Pittsburgh, Erie, Cleveland, and others provide those. However, I am disabled (bad heart) and find that routine care is abundant locally interspersed with occasional trips to Erie. Don’t get me wrong; I hear UPMC Northwest (about a 7 mile commute for me) is fine and has Cardiac-Rehab and Cancer treatment facilities. Private practices seem to be abundant (including specialists) in the area.
As you present as young and probably healthy, the preceding may be a minor issue.
Taxes
www.co.venango.pa.us/home/index.htm (broken link)
Click on: Real Estate Millages (bottom-left of Government selections) for a complete listing of all governmental property/school tax rates for Venango County.
County Municipal School
Specifically: City of Oil City 5.565 9.600 16.610
Remember: these are in mills, not percentages.
See the Links area as well for other info.
Also see: www.oilcity.org/ not much in way of detail (local taxes, etc.), but OC Government structure/contacts, many pictures (nostalgic), and business/local culture links. Also a link (bottom-left) to access online videos (promotional) for those interested in relocating to OC. Of course, these don’t show problem areas although these exist.
Earned Income Tax: 1% (0.5% to City of Oil City, 0.5% to School District)
Emergency and Municipal Services Tax: $52 ($47 to City of Oil City, $5 to School District)
Per Capita Tax: $10 ($5 to City of Oil City, $5 to School District)
Mercantile/Business Privilege Tax: Retail/Other: 0.7450 mills; Wholesale: 0.4300 mills
Realty Transfer Tax: 1% of Purchase Price (0.5% to City of Oil City, 0.5% to School District)
Summary
You DO need to do YOUR research for any location you are looking into. I believe you can narrow selections using forums like this, pictures, and other sources but eventually you WILL HAVE TO visit to see and judge for yourself no matter the location(s) you zero in on.
I’m not recommending you move to Oil City, but I’m not discouraging that either. It’s your choice.
Good luck in your endeavor no matter where you decide to live.
Wow great informative long post! Gave you positive reputation. I am still researching other locations but Oil city is still the top of my list. I am sick of south FL for many reasons, you can see why in my other posts. There are better locations than Oil city but at like 5 times the price it just isnt worth it.
Do you live in Oil city now? Id love to chat to you on AIM and when I visit Oil city, id be honored if you gave me a tour around
As for crime, its very low unlike south Florida's massive crime problem. Ive checked house prices in Oil city and it looks like some people are selling huge 2000 square feet houses for $50k, good deal id say
srsmail1,I'm glad you were able to give NAH expanded explanation of the area. I have told him some of the things you mentioned as I have lived in oil city and my sister moved back there 4 years ago from lexington south carolina. I haven't been to oil city since 2000 as I am now in Gaston South Carolina. Personally if it wasn't for the snow I would move back there myself.
If my husband had his way we would be there as he really liked the town.
He never lived there but has been there because of me,he is from minneapolis.
But you are correct alot of people are giving advice from afar and most know nothing of the city just assumptions.I'm glad you were able to go into such great detail..awesome job.
What I would love to see is pictures of that city and Franklin and any other cities next to Oil city if possible. Pictures of the houses is especially welcome as are pictures of all the stores and shopping. Also do you know what condition those big $50k houses are? Most of them seem to be move in condition accroding to the seller.
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I am on my 3rd home, after 25 years of marriage and so far, besides living in a house instead of an apartment, home ownership still has not been a great advantage.
