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By overall influence (socioeconomic, cultural, logistical, financial, historical) how would you rank New Orleans, Honolulu, Salt Lake City, and Raleigh? I would probably prefer economic be the largest factor.
I will leave it up to you how to define these areas - but I would prefer metro statistical area (MSA) or urban area, as opposed to city proper or CSA. New Orleans and Honolulu are very landlocked / limited in their ability to expand, and are each about 1 million MSAs. While SLC and Raleigh are much larger, but sprawling.
Honolulu: one of the most visited cities in the USA. Major military presence. One of the most urban downtowns in the nation (downtown is equivalent to a metro of 4-5 million), largest major city for thousands of miles, extremely strong identity. Hub of the Hawaii island chain. One of the most expensive real estate markets in the nation.1 million area.
New Orleans: largest city in the Confederate States of America. One of the largest cities in the USA in its early formation, industrialization. Major major port. Oil industry/rigs. Major major cultural heritage and influence. French, Cajun. Perhaps the most urban grided downtown in the Southern USA. Future is uncertain with rising sea levels and impact from storms. Almost 1.3 million area.
Salt Lake City: fast growing. Home of Mormon Church. Nearby Ogden (big IRS center) and Provo (Brigham Young Univ) could add a boost to SLC, not sure if they should be separate entities or all combined. They are kinda far from SLC (35-40 miles). Over 2.7 million population if all combined. Beautiful scenery, located along on Amtrak, largest city in a large area. Expensive, growing, and seems like high quality of life area.
Raleigh: fast growing. Potential to become America's "it city" (IMO was Seattle, currently Austin, could be Raleigh in the future). Duke University, UNC, NC State, tons of other colleges and universities, renowned research facilities. I would probably include Durham with Raleigh, giving this area over 2.1 million.
MSA's:
Honolulu: 1,000,890
New Orleans 1,261,726
Salt Lake City (no Ogden, no Provo) 1,263,061
Ogden (alone) 706,696
Provo (alone) 697,141
Raleigh (no Durham) 1,448,411
Durham (alone) 654,012
4 Honolulu - too isolated, hospitality and tourism are huge to their economy--which is vulnerable to economic swings
3 New Orleans - future is dicey; susceptible to storms, flooding. Not a lot of land to expand on. Would love to see this city have a resurgence and boom though--a long shot for sure
2 Salt Lake City - could be on the cusp of a potential boom. Downside is location in the west, with climate change and more fires, less water. But lots of positives going for it for growth.
1 Raleigh - the strongest future of all of these. Incredible universities in the area, strong companies moving in, great quality of life, with proximity to the mountains and the ocean, and east coast metros, not super far away.
4 Honolulu - too isolated, hospitality and tourism are huge to their economy--which is vulnerable to economic swings
3 New Orleans - future is dicey; susceptible to storms, flooding. Not a lot of land to expand on. Would love to see this city have a resurgence and boom though--a long shot for sure
2 Salt Lake City - could be on the cusp of a potential boom. Downside is location in the west, with climate change and more fires, less water. But lots of positives going for it for growth.
1 Raleigh - the strongest future of all of these. Incredible universities in the area, strong companies moving in, great quality of life, with proximity to the mountains and the ocean, and east coast metros, not super far away.
This seems like a good summary. One might predict Raleigh winning this exercise based on its fundamentals alone - its larger sized economy, higher ed concentration, forward-looking prospects. I still believe there is strong evidence supporting Raleigh over the others. But, these comparisons are always more than meets the eye - New Orleans and Honolulu *seem* to be leading the poll thus far probably based on their sheer uniqueness/distinct identities, brand name recognition, visitor draw, and national cultural influence.
I am curious to see if we could get a few more votes/opinions on the poll or more comments from other posters.
By overall influence (socioeconomic, cultural, logistical, financial, historical) how would you rank New Orleans, Honolulu, Salt Lake City, and Raleigh? I would probably prefer economic be the largest factor.
The ranking of the actual economic influence of each of these metro areas is inversely proportional to the degree to which the majority of citizens in said metro areas care about being in an "influential" area.
Last edited by TarHeelNick; 04-19-2022 at 08:53 AM..
The ranking of the actual economic influence of each of these metro areas is inversely proportional to the degree to which the majority of citizens in said metro areas care about being in an "influential" area.
Could you elaborate, I am confused by what you mean? I *think* what you are trying to point out is: overhyped cities are in fact largely overhyped. ?
Anyway I selected economic factors to be the focus because IMO they do carry the largest weight/criteria.
Could you elaborate, I am confused by what you mean? I *think* what you are trying to point out is: overhyped cities are in fact largely overhyped. ?
Anyway I selected economic factors to be the focus because IMO they do carry the largest weight/criteria.
Basically...based on economic output (GDP) and population growth; the "ranking" would be SLC, Raleigh...big gap.... New Orleans, Honolulu. Based on actual data. (and that is Raleigh not including Durham/CH which is where Duke, UNC, and most of RTP is located; include the whole Triangle area and it would edge out SLC valley in that regard)
But based on "caring that my city is ranked highly and considered influential" and general C-D forum culture....those rankings would be almost the exact opposite. At least by anecdotal observation (and probably switch NOLA and Honolulu in that ranking)
Tarheel well I did make mention in my op that SLC and Raleigh were much larger more sprawling areas. But that does not mean they should instantly win either.
But I honestly still felt that these four cities were super close enough in ranking to merit an opinion poll.
Economic prowess isn't the only factor, I just said it is likely the biggest (political is up there too, maybe even yet greater). Culture, history, logistics can make up for a lesser economic standing. The whole exercise is ultimately subjective.
I did say Raleigh should likely include Durham. But this is also where these comparisons always start turning into that gray area where not 100% of people agree. Is 25 miles too far? Do cities have a certain gravitational pull based on their mass? Most people I think assume Raleigh and Durham would be together. Most people I've talked to refer to that area as the Triangle.
At this point I am just curious to see what the poll shows. I hope we get a good turnout and some valued insights.
I have personally never set foot in any of these cities, nor have any horses in the race. I just very much enjoy ranking cities.
So I added up the positions of all votes so far
1st place =1
2nd place=2
3rd place=3
4th place=4
Assuming I added correctly
Lower score is better, means higher ranking/more influential
1. New Orleans 27
2. Honolulu 46
3. Salt Lake City 47
4. Raleigh 50
So basically New Orleans is leading by a strong margin and the remaining three are almost dead tied. Only 17 votes so far, still a bit small of a sample size.
Honolulu has to be in last place, I can't find any measure by which it shouldn't be. It isn't an important place on really any scale in American culture, besides being a popular tourist trap for West Coasters...
Being popular amongst tourists is cool but we have to temper the relevancy we allow for that...
For me, New Orleans has to be third place. It has the largest historical profile of any of these cities but certainly isn't all that important today. It is still relevant in aspects of American pop culture but economically is a laggard...
I think you could order Salt Lake and Raleigh either way and couldn't be wrong. Salt Lake is certainly an important city in a large radius of land and has outsized influence that belies its actual population. Which, I guess the same could be said of Nola to a lesser degree. The way SLC continues to grow though bodes well for its future, and it has an outstanding economy. Much of the same descriptives can be said of Raleigh; the biggest question of Raleigh would be if it's high quality of life and continually exploding economy and wealth are accurate reflections of its "importance"...
I think that's a fair question. I don't know that I believe Raleigh is that significant but I see no window where Honolulu is even as significant, nor where Nola is more significant in the 21st century. So I think it's a coin flip Rgh/SLC, then Nola, then Honolulu...
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